RE: Disproving Odin - An Experiment in arguing with a theist with Theist logic
March 18, 2018 at 2:11 pm
(March 18, 2018 at 11:13 am)Grandizer Wrote:Or we could just accept they don't have an existence of their own and are the product of our brain like we know they are. No matter how much theists want to make them a spooky otherly substance to save the god pixie from falling on their own reasoning .(March 18, 2018 at 9:03 am)SteveII Wrote: No, one can't argue that. The novel or symphony is not made out of the same material as the brain or paper. They have not material cause. Only efficient causes. You are not arguing with me on some sort of interpretation. You are arguing with established definitions.
Requiring material objects to exist is just a feature of our universe.
Abstract objects are mental/mind-based, so one could argue that they have a material cause in the "mind material". But it doesn't matter either way, because material objects that begin to exist must require material causes (per the outdated Aristotelian logic). And even Aristotle himself argued that the universe/world must be eternal. In fact, the argument I presented earlier is virtually the same as the argument presented by Aristotle.
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.
Inuit Proverb
Inuit Proverb