RE: Disproving Odin - An Experiment in arguing with a theist with Theist logic
March 19, 2018 at 5:59 pm
(March 19, 2018 at 5:34 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: I don't recall what the point in bringing up the immateriality of symphonies and such was, but it seems to rest on a non sequitur. I don't see any reason to necessarily conclude that a symphony is anything more than stuff doing what stuff does.
It was a challenge to one of the premises of the argument I presented earlier: the premise that everything that begins to exist must have a material cause. Steve seems to think that if he can demonstrate that some objects we're familiar with do not have material causes, then material cause (unlike efficient cause) isn't so essential. Fair enough, but the best he can point to in this case are abstract objects like symphonies, and as you have just argued, that itself is problematic a counter to use.