RE: Disproving Odin - An Experiment in arguing with a theist with Theist logic
March 22, 2018 at 4:48 pm
(This post was last modified: March 22, 2018 at 4:48 pm by Angrboda.)
(March 22, 2018 at 3:56 pm)SteveII Wrote: Personal: Rather than me reword WLC explanation of Ghazali's explanation, here it is:
Quote:Finally, Ghazali argued that this Uncaused First Cause must also be a personal being. It’s the only way to explain how an eternal cause can produce an effect with a beginning like the universe.
Here’s the problem: If a cause is sufficient to produce its effect, then if the cause is there, the effect must be there, too. For example, the cause of water’s freezing is the temperature’s being below 0 degrees Celsius. If the temperature has been below 0 degrees from eternity, then any water around would be frozen from eternity. It would be impossible for the water to begin to freeze just a finite time ago. Now the cause of the universe is permanently there, since it is timeless. So why isn’t the universe permanently there as well? Why did the universe come into being only 14 billion years ago? Why isn’t it as permanent as its cause?
Ghazali maintained that the answer to this problem is that the First Cause must be a personal being endowed with freedom of the will. His creating the universe is a free act which is independent of any prior determining conditions. So his act of creating can be something spontaneous and new. Freedom of the will enables one to get an effect with a beginning from a permanent, timeless cause. Thus, we are brought not merely to a transcendent cause of the universe but to its Personal Creator.
https://www.reasonablefaith.org/writings...-argument/
Do you or Craig have any evidence that the creation event did not occur immediately upon the necessary prior conditions being fulfilled? Some theologians posit that there is no separation between God being and God creating.
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