(October 7, 2018 at 1:10 pm)Khemikal Wrote:(October 7, 2018 at 12:23 pm)DLJ Wrote: Here's the crux:It's possible for people to reach a consensus..it becomes more plausible when we posit that there may be moral facts, however, those moral facts are not based upon that consensus.
You and I, Rob, see this as 'consensus' rather than 'objective'... As different people value different things we cannot reach the same kind of objectivity (impartially etc.) that we can with two or more scientists agreeing about the facts about the house or quantity of water in the jug.
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Sure.
I guess I'm not seeing the relevance of moral facts. Moral fiction can be equally as useful in reaching a consensus.
(October 7, 2018 at 1:10 pm)Khemikal Wrote: ...
To put it even more briefly. That there is a consensus (if there is) is far less important than how any consensus is reached.
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Maybe so. Was it Eisenhower that said that "the battle plan is useless; the battle planning is vital" (or words to that effect)?
(October 7, 2018 at 1:10 pm)Khemikal Wrote:(October 7, 2018 at 12:23 pm)DLJ Wrote: Short answer: Nope.Well, if I can't get you to agree that we're talking about something, if I can't get you to agree on at least one of what those things are, and I can't get you to agree that some statements may be true or false...how can we have a discussion about -anything-?
I'm not entirely clear on upon what you've asked for agreement.
I have no problem with the idea that we can label propositions true or false (or even partially true/false), although there can be 'true and false' and 'neither true or false'... as adherents to some forms of Buddhism and IT programmers will inform us.
(October 7, 2018 at 1:10 pm)Khemikal Wrote:(October 7, 2018 at 12:23 pm)DLJ Wrote: I kinda like that.Is that an objective statement..or just your opinion?
OK, we don't do 'souls' anymore and back then "common sense" is what we would nowadays call 'critical thinking' but it has a subtle mix of the biological event-process (sense), thresholds (conscience), duty, values and consequentialism; it also includes a focus on continual improvements of maturity and capability.
Importantly it identifies what is actually at the root of a morality system... our sense of balance / equilibrium.
It is a hemi-semi-demi-educated, professional opinion.
What else would it be?
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The PURPOSE of life is to replicate our DNA ................. (from Darwin)
The MEANING of life is the experience of living ... (from Frank Herbert)
The VALUE of life is the legacy we leave behind ..... (from observation)
The MEANING of life is the experience of living ... (from Frank Herbert)
The VALUE of life is the legacy we leave behind ..... (from observation)