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Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"?
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"?
(October 18, 2018 at 8:50 am)DLJ Wrote:
(October 18, 2018 at 7:33 am)Thoreauvian Wrote: That's relativity, not subjectivity.  Subjectivity means morality is inescapably a matter of fallible opinion.

"Subjective morality is the perspective that moral claims don't really have a truth value."
https://www.google.com/search?q=subjecti...e&ie=UTF-8

It's an ambiguous term as it is used differently by different disciplines in different ways.   I used it above in a general context of being 'of the self' which is relevant to 3a, 3b, 4a, 4c from Merriam-Webster, below (which, I believe, is a US publication which is why they state #1a as being obsolete.  It's not obsolete if you are a subject of QEII):

Quote:subjective adjective
sub·jec·tive | \(ˌ)səb-ˈjek-tiv  \
Definition of subjective (Entry 1 of 2)
1 : of, relating to, or constituting a subject: such as
a obsolete : of, relating to, or characteristic of one that is a subject especially in lack of freedom of action or in submissiveness
b : being or relating to a grammatical subject
especially : NOMINATIVE
2 : of or relating to the essential being of that which has substance, qualities, attributes, or relations
3a : characteristic of or belonging to reality as perceived rather than as independent of mind : PHENOMENAL — compare OBJECTIVE sense 1b
b : relating to or being experience or knowledge as conditioned by personal mental characteristics or states
4a(1) : peculiar to a particular individual : PERSONAL
subjective judgments
(2) : modified or affected by personal views, experience, or background
a subjective account of the incident
b : arising from conditions within the brain or sense organs and not directly caused by external stimuli
subjective sensations
c : arising out of or identified by means of one's perception of one's own states and processes
a subjective symptom of disease
— compare OBJECTIVE sense 1c
5 : lacking in reality or substance : ILLUSORY

Given that the moral alert/alarm (sense of right or wrong) occurs prior to any analytical processes having the chance to rationalise anything, it must be deeply subjective.  So where in the process does the 'opinion' part happen?

This is why I have been advocating dropping the terms objective and subjective.  In best practices, and particularly in best practices that relate to information systems and processes, having more than one definition for a given term is akin to the original sin.  

I suspect that this is at the root of why filosofers haven't cracked this one yet.  

:nod emoji:

Big Grin

The obvious problem with your critique is that we can make moral judgments about other people without being involved personally ourselves.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 2:13 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Ivan Denisovich - September 28, 2018 at 2:30 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 4:27 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Valkyrie - September 28, 2018 at 2:49 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 2:52 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:27 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 8:27 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:30 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 8:33 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:36 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 8:39 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:43 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 8:44 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:46 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 8:48 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by SaStrike - September 28, 2018 at 9:21 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - September 28, 2018 at 9:41 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 9:45 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by unfogged - September 28, 2018 at 10:46 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by John V - October 1, 2018 at 3:49 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by possibletarian - September 28, 2018 at 8:47 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by emjay - September 28, 2018 at 8:47 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Valkyrie - September 28, 2018 at 3:10 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - September 28, 2018 at 5:22 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 6:05 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 7:33 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Belacqua - September 28, 2018 at 7:11 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Fireball - September 28, 2018 at 7:46 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - September 28, 2018 at 8:47 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Silver - September 28, 2018 at 8:48 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 9:23 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 9:40 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 9:47 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by FatAndFaithless - September 28, 2018 at 9:53 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 10:07 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 10:20 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Mister Agenda - September 28, 2018 at 10:27 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Grand Nudger - September 28, 2018 at 10:28 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 10:42 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - September 28, 2018 at 10:36 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Grand Nudger - September 28, 2018 at 10:57 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 11:08 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Grand Nudger - September 28, 2018 at 11:37 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 12:14 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Grand Nudger - September 28, 2018 at 11:59 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by SaStrike - September 28, 2018 at 1:36 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by The Grand Nudger - September 28, 2018 at 12:15 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by I_am_not_mafia - September 28, 2018 at 12:19 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by vulcanlogician - September 28, 2018 at 10:42 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - September 28, 2018 at 10:52 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by vulcanlogician - September 28, 2018 at 11:21 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 2:17 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - October 1, 2018 at 3:02 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Alan V - October 4, 2018 at 10:43 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 10:50 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - September 28, 2018 at 11:30 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 3:49 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 1, 2018 at 10:05 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 4:12 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 6:38 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 4:24 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 6:01 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 9:50 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 10:30 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - October 1, 2018 at 6:42 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by no one - October 1, 2018 at 7:37 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 1, 2018 at 11:31 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 2, 2018 at 12:48 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - October 2, 2018 at 8:01 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 2, 2018 at 10:59 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 3:07 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 6:41 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 9:50 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 4, 2018 at 9:59 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 10:02 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 10:58 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 11:06 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 11:34 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 4, 2018 at 11:58 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 4, 2018 at 11:41 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 5, 2018 at 7:00 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 5, 2018 at 7:43 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 5, 2018 at 9:14 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 5, 2018 at 10:05 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 6, 2018 at 1:55 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by bennyboy - October 6, 2018 at 4:47 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 6, 2018 at 6:05 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 7, 2018 at 2:03 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 7, 2018 at 9:31 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 7, 2018 at 3:49 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 7, 2018 at 12:23 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 7, 2018 at 12:38 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 7, 2018 at 12:54 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 7, 2018 at 1:33 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 8, 2018 at 8:31 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 10, 2018 at 6:52 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 11, 2018 at 11:19 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by TTT - October 12, 2018 at 12:57 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 12, 2018 at 1:34 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by TTT - October 12, 2018 at 2:15 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 12, 2018 at 4:31 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 12, 2018 at 5:29 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 12, 2018 at 5:09 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 13, 2018 at 11:25 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 12, 2018 at 5:50 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 12, 2018 at 7:35 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 12, 2018 at 7:48 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 12, 2018 at 8:10 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 13, 2018 at 10:48 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 13, 2018 at 12:41 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 13, 2018 at 2:55 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 14, 2018 at 5:16 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 16, 2018 at 1:45 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Belacqua - October 14, 2018 at 6:37 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 16, 2018 at 3:07 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 16, 2018 at 3:44 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 16, 2018 at 8:36 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 16, 2018 at 1:47 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 16, 2018 at 3:44 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 17, 2018 at 12:43 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 17, 2018 at 5:56 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Alan V - October 18, 2018 at 7:33 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 18, 2018 at 8:50 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Alan V - October 18, 2018 at 11:06 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 17, 2018 at 9:25 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 18, 2018 at 7:12 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by robvalue - October 18, 2018 at 7:19 am
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by Angrboda - October 18, 2018 at 12:25 pm
RE: Does anyone own "The Moral Landscape"? - by DLJ - October 18, 2018 at 1:04 pm

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