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Never call other humans disbelievers!
#32
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers!
(October 29, 2018 at 6:47 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:
(October 29, 2018 at 6:40 pm)Grandizer Wrote: If I disbelieve after the knowledge I have, then I am a disbeliever. You said this yourself in an earlier post, and I argued that I do have enough knowledge to consciously disbelieve. In fact, that's what explicit atheists (which is a thing) are doing. They consciously disbelieve the existence of God after much reading and pondering.

I don't think you understand. Moses proved God when he spoke, but Pharaoh and his people were truly in that state of disbelief, per Quran, and the truth only came when his hand turned into a bright light that didn't harm with evil people's eyes (ie. the brightness though super bright cause no damage to eyes and they all saw it bright).

It was then truth became that apparent.

And it was only when Pharoah and his people had a resolve "no matter what signs you bring, we know that you are only a sorcerer", that God judged them too stubborn, because it didn't matter at that point, what level of miracle and sign and proof, but even then, he brought a punishing sign, and they swore they would accept him if he lifted the punishment but they didn't.

Sometimes people are stubborn to what Quran says, like people denying Wilayah of Ali in there even when they know better, but often, people are heedless and don't know better.

All I'm saying is I withdraw judgment.

Read the appended edit in my prior post. Again, you can't get any worse than that as a "disbeliever". I'm not that different from Pharaoh, except I would intellectually acknowledge that it's god, I just wouldn't emotionally accept it as god. If anything, the Pharaoh in your example was a more mild "disbeliever" than I am because he was still convinced that your god wasn't the true god (but just a sorcerer).

Edit: Had to add some scare quotes because what's happening is that two senses of the term "disbelief" and its derivatives are being used interchangeably, leading to a lot of confusion. And all because you want to keep living in this fantasy world where people like me don't really disbelieve but are just ignorant and don't know any better. Yeah, because we're just cattle and sheep here, we don't know shit. Talk about such a low [implicit] view of atheists.
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Messages In This Thread
Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 2:11 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Minimalist - October 29, 2018 at 2:54 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by downbeatplumb - October 29, 2018 at 2:56 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 2:56 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Minimalist - October 29, 2018 at 2:59 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 3:01 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by LadyForCamus - October 29, 2018 at 10:12 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 2:59 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Silver - October 29, 2018 at 3:01 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Deesse23 - October 29, 2018 at 3:18 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Minimalist - October 29, 2018 at 3:02 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 3:03 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Minimalist - October 29, 2018 at 4:59 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Joods - October 29, 2018 at 7:06 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by SaStrike - October 29, 2018 at 3:08 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by downbeatplumb - October 29, 2018 at 3:13 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 3:18 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by SaStrike - October 29, 2018 at 3:21 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Losty - October 29, 2018 at 10:33 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Pat Mustard - October 29, 2018 at 5:11 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 5:29 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by robvalue - October 29, 2018 at 5:30 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 5:42 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by no one - October 29, 2018 at 6:04 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Grandizer - October 29, 2018 at 6:27 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 6:29 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Grandizer - October 29, 2018 at 6:35 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 6:37 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Grandizer - October 29, 2018 at 6:40 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 6:47 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Grandizer - October 29, 2018 at 7:01 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Belacqua - October 29, 2018 at 7:27 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by MysticKnight - October 29, 2018 at 7:34 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Grandizer - October 29, 2018 at 7:42 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by WinterHold - October 29, 2018 at 7:28 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by Gwaithmir - October 29, 2018 at 7:37 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by brewer - October 29, 2018 at 8:49 pm
RE: Never call other humans disbelievers! - by robvalue - October 29, 2018 at 10:40 pm

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