(August 11, 2019 at 10:36 pm)Grandizer Wrote:(August 11, 2019 at 10:34 pm)Acrobat Wrote: The perception.
Both of us, and perhaps anyone whose not being dishonest, is aware that their recognition of right and wrong, is not a recognition of their internal biological state, as an articulation of their likes and dislikes or personal feeling etc..Unlike when we say a particular song is good, or a particular dish is good, etc.. where good described a quality of their feelings.
We perceive good as external to us, not as an internal state.
I don't need to subscribe to your particular moral theory, or even be able to define good, to recognize this. Just like I don't need a definition of the sun, or even know much of anything about the sun's nature, to recognize that it exists outside of myself. My definition, nor my moral theory is the source of it's existence.
From this, the question is what is the nature of this thing, that both you and I acknowledge seeing.
Are you trying now to suggest good is just an abstract thought, that resides solely in our mind? That seems to be a contradiction of your rejection of good as a description of our internal states.
External things can be seen as good or bad. But the assignment of good and bad comes from us, not from "out there"
A pizza is an external thing, saying it's good and bad comes from us, it's as expression of our taste and feelings, our likes and dislikes. When i say this pizza is good, I'm telling you that it tastes pleasant to me. Good and bad here are expressions of my biological, internal state.
You agreed that this is not what you mean when referring to good and bad in a moral sense, that good and bad are not an expression of your likes and dislikes. When you say that the holocaust (an external thing) is bad, you're not saying it's bad simply because you don't like it (which would be true for the pizza).
Clearly you recognize the nature of good and bad in a moral sense, is distinctly different then when we use good bad when referring to subjective things like fashion, taste in music movies, etc....
" I cannot see how to refute the arguments for the subjectivity of ethical values but I find myself incapable of believing that all that is wrong with wanton cruelty is that I don’t like it." - Bertrand Russell (though it's probably a good description of the place you find yourself in now)