(August 13, 2019 at 9:32 am)Acrobat Wrote:Quote:Our words used as we use them in science, are vessels capable only of containing and converting meaning and sense, natural meaning and sense. Ethics, if it anything, is supernatural and our words will only express facts ; as a teacup will only hold a teacup full of water and if I were to pour out a gallon over it. "
Thank you for the passage from Wittgenstein. I've found and read a couple of essays on this topic this morning, and I'll try to read his Lecture on Ethics today. It's only 8 pages!
I'm beginning to understand your argument better, from this and from skimming more of this thread.
In a way, people are agreeing with you on the main point, I think. There is clearly nothing quantifiable in the material world which can be identified as good or bad. It's not something we can see in a microscope. But people here seem to agree that there are obvious moral facts. For example, if you cut the head off a baby, it's clearly bad. And if they demand "why?" we can say "because it deprives the baby of life, liberty, and happiness." And we can respond, "but why is it bad to do that?" And eventually the argument is just "because it just is." So in a sense people are agreeing with you. It's not something material, but it's clear and true.
From there I guess people are worried about the terms involved. A lot of people would call such immaterial but clear and true ideas "transcendental." Wittgenstein uses the term "supernatural." Of course he was careful with his words and doesn't use the word in its general popular sense.
I was disappointed to see that at least 3 people here apparently consider the Wittgenstein quote to be "word salad." It takes a lot of arrogance to dismiss things like that.
Anyway, this is an interesting topic and I look forward to working on it. I'll go read the lecture now.
