Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: November 22, 2024, 10:00 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
A Working Draft Design Argument
#39
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument
(October 13, 2019 at 7:13 pm)Acrobat Wrote: P1- Intentionality gives things value and meaning. Novels possess intrinsic values and meaning, as a result of being authored, designed, endowed by their authors to posses such elements.

P2-If reality possess value and meaning, we can use logic to infer a cause, from an effect. I.E. That which possess values and meaning, indicate intentionality, authorship, design, etc..

P3-Determinism is true. To ask for proof of determinism, implies it’s true. The question itself requires determinism to be true, preceding factors to reach x conclusion, the conclusion is drawn from previously existing causes.

P4-All preceding factors, have preceding factors of their own, until one reaches a point which posses no preceding factors, i.e a first cause, or a type of  uncaused singularity, that’s the ultimate determining cause of all causes, all knowledge, all past and future, events, all values and meanings, etc..

P5- Since reality possess values and meanings, that are ultimately rooted in the first cause, reality is an intentional work, authored designed, a novel.

I'm going to modify the argument according to my understanding. Correct me if I word something wrong. Note premises won't necessarily match yours, but the argument should hopefully be the same overall.

P1) Something indicates intentionality if values and meanings are assignable to it and all that it contains.

P2) If values and meanings are assignable to reality and all that it contains, reality indicates intentionality.

P3) If something indicates intentionality, then this intentionality is grounded in a being that is apart from (or independent of) this something and is able to assign values and meanings.

C) Reality, indicating intentionality, must have this intentionality grounded in a cause that is apart from (or independent of) it and is able to assign values and meanings.

Unless I'm mistaken, this appears to be a more clearly valid argument.

The question is whether the argument is sound. In this case, I sense that the problem is with P3 of this modified argument.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 13, 2019 at 7:13 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Belacqua - October 13, 2019 at 7:21 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 13, 2019 at 7:31 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 13, 2019 at 9:00 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 13, 2019 at 10:24 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 13, 2019 at 10:48 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 13, 2019 at 11:09 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 13, 2019 at 11:41 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 13, 2019 at 11:57 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 12:03 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 12:12 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 12:28 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 12:41 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 4:36 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Anomalocaris - October 14, 2019 at 6:28 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 15, 2019 at 6:26 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Anomalocaris - October 15, 2019 at 3:34 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by downbeatplumb - October 15, 2019 at 2:55 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 14, 2019 at 4:33 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 8:10 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 9:05 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 9:17 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 9:52 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 9:59 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 10:11 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 14, 2019 at 10:32 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 14, 2019 at 5:05 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 15, 2019 at 7:44 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 15, 2019 at 4:34 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Abaddon_ire - October 17, 2019 at 3:25 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Brian37 - October 14, 2019 at 6:49 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by chimp3 - October 15, 2019 at 7:54 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 15, 2019 at 8:21 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by chimp3 - October 15, 2019 at 8:24 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 15, 2019 at 9:34 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by chimp3 - October 15, 2019 at 7:15 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 15, 2019 at 7:37 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by chimp3 - October 15, 2019 at 8:01 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 16, 2019 at 7:16 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by chimp3 - October 16, 2019 at 7:12 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Cod - October 15, 2019 at 8:07 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 16, 2019 at 3:49 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Pat Mustard - October 16, 2019 at 6:05 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Pat Mustard - October 17, 2019 at 6:33 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Belacqua - October 17, 2019 at 7:08 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Acrobat - October 17, 2019 at 12:59 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 17, 2019 at 7:13 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Pat Mustard - October 19, 2019 at 10:28 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Deesse23 - October 16, 2019 at 11:04 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 17, 2019 at 6:44 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Belacqua - October 18, 2019 at 6:36 am
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 18, 2019 at 1:42 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Anomalocaris - October 18, 2019 at 2:01 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Abaddon_ire - October 18, 2019 at 2:44 pm
RE: A Working Draft Design Argument - by Grandizer - October 18, 2019 at 3:10 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Intelligent Design (brief overview). Mystic 70 15183 May 9, 2018 at 2:17 pm
Last Post: Gawdzilla Sama
  Intelligent (?) Design Minimalist 12 4699 August 21, 2017 at 1:23 am
Last Post: Minimalist
  If God of Abraham is true, then why didnt he use his intelligent design to make a new Roeki 129 50440 July 9, 2017 at 2:11 am
Last Post: Astonished
  Working backwards. Mystic 52 10608 February 26, 2017 at 6:19 pm
Last Post: Athene
  The stupid "Apex" "design" argument..... Brian37 23 6567 March 4, 2016 at 11:32 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
Video Intelligent Design, The Designer is Drunk! Mental Outlaw 6 2390 March 15, 2015 at 6:24 pm
Last Post: robvalue
  Why intelligent design "proofs" are pointless robvalue 27 6999 September 13, 2014 at 4:14 pm
Last Post: fr0d0
  I find it hilarious when men argue intelligent design. Lemonvariable72 10 4655 December 3, 2013 at 6:03 am
Last Post: Mothonis
  Derren Brown on 'Intelligent' Design Gooders1002 0 1238 December 8, 2012 at 6:20 am
Last Post: Gooders1002
  Prayer not working zebo-the-fat 84 39225 November 11, 2012 at 5:31 pm
Last Post: IATIA



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)