(November 19, 2019 at 8:00 pm)Belacqua Wrote:(November 19, 2019 at 12:34 pm)Grandizer Wrote: Let's say subconsciously I stopped believing in Christ because, for example, a bunch of Christians disappointed me big time with their behaviour. Would this be what led to my non-belief? Yes. Would this be the only way I could ever justify my lack of belief to this day? No.
I can grow in knowledge and understanding, and challenge my current positions to see if they hold water in the face of current observations. If I find that I have good arguments and/or evidence that continues to confirm my "non-belief" and lack good arguments and/or evidence that disconfirms my "non-belief", I have reason to continue doubting. And that I count as post hoc justification for my continued "non-belief". If, however, I were to be presented with arguments or evidence to the contrary, especially strong enough to shatter my "non-belief", then I think I no longer have justification for my "non-belief".
Assuming my subconscious biases don't get the better of me, of course.
Christians have long recognized that the evidence of the senses is untrustworthy, and human reason is fallible.
This of course is why they claim that revelation is superior -- it is knowledge unmediated by flawed human faculties.
What they fail to accept (when they hold this strictly) is that everything we know and believe is mediated. The whole structure of how we evaluate truth claims is given to us by our culture, and is itself based on a long uncountable series of contingencies. Each one of us, if he's honest, will be comfortable with the fact that if history had been different, we would think differently.
If atheists are claiming that somehow their truth-claims are not subject to this history, and are not contingent on a million things that they themselves didn't choose, then they are not yet sufficiently aware of the background in their own minds.
And I don't accept that this can be avoided by claiming that one doesn't have beliefs -- only lack of beliefs. The assertion that there is insufficient evidence for God is itself rooted in a number of things we hold to be true (i.e. believe). And the web of beliefs that allows us to live comfortably in the world without religion is itself contingent on history.
From experience I know that a few people will argue just about anything to avoid accepting that this is so.
It goes like this:
Theist: there is a god, i know it to be true!
Atheist: how do you know it to be true?
Theist: its self-evident
Atheist: so you have no evidence?
Theist: no
Atheist: then, so far, i have no reason to believe your claim
Im still unsure why this is so hard for you to grasp there bel.
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.