Women-Life-Freedom Movement in Iran

[Leonardo17]

Ahriman: I don’t think this is healthy. If it is cultural, it’s a culture that’s completely unhealthy. See ın the Movie “American Pie” you have one of the boy who is doing it with his mother’s cake for instance. Here, in Ankara, I’ve had a female friend who was relating me how she, while travelling in an omnibus had a young man staring at her uncovered arm. She was asking “Has this man ever seen an arm already? Why could he be staring at my arm?”

  Also, in very ancient times, that is in the 70’s when even printed magazines were not really circulating among the younger generations, as I am hearing there were cases of young people, using some vegetables, or in villages, even animals for sexual satisfaction purpose.
   So yes, maybe it’s culture. But if it’s culture than there has to be problem with that culture. I mean in the article it says ankles. Who cares about ankles?

Belaqua:

“No, I don't think that's right.

In America it's considered unacceptable for a naked woman to walk through Walmart. Is this rule based on obsessive-compulsive disorder?

Just because you don't approve of another culture's customs doesn't mean you can diagnose them as obsessive-compulsive. “
America is not Africa. It doesn’t have a tropical climate either (except for Hawaii perhaps). So there are times in the year when everybody has to get covered up anyway. The problem is, in a tropical climate nobody would care after a while. But today, when you enter a shopping mall naked or half naked people will stare at you. I don’t know if the punishment is very severe, but I wouldn’t do that. Why would you do that?

People in Britain did for a long time. Just because you find a body part unstimulating doesn't mean you get to choose for the whole world.

In Japan, women's breasts were not considered sexually stimulating for a long time. 18th and 19th century Japanese porn (intended to stimulate) usually doesn't show them, though it's OK to show them in pictures of nursing mothers, female swimmers, etc. (As far as I can tell, boobs became stimulating to Japanese people when they started wearing western fashions, which emphasize the bust. Kimono flatten the bust and don't offer it as a stimulant.)

Does the fact that the US outlaws toplessness in public places prove that the US is mentally ill?

1) I’ve heard about foot fetishism but I haven’t heard anyone being stimulated by ankles. And that’s what I’m talking about. Isn’t fetishism a form of obsession?

2) You’ve made this remark before on the breasts. I know there were cultures in the past who showed them openly. The prophet Mahomed himself is said to have ordered the women of a given tribe to cover their breasts. But I’ve never heard such a thing about the Japanese. On the contrary. I watched the movie “The memoir’s of a Geisha” in 2005 and I think the obsession with the female body that is depicted in this movie is very similar to the “pious” Muslim’s obsession with the female body. Freud calls this sublimation. And because of this sublimation issue in countries like mine or like India, you have countless killing of women that are related to some “love” or unrequited love issues. You don’t really have that in America. Here, the guy can just show up with a gun in his hand, shoot you, than shoot himself and the (corrupt) authorities will call it “murder because of love”. Again, could there be a “murder because of love”? – Isn’t that pure nonsense?

3) No. But I am not even making a gender differentiation here. Supposing that your body is not totally repulsive for your age, even if you did something like that in school for instance, both girls and boys would stare at you. As I said this isn’t the African Savanah or some island in the pacific. People are not used to it so they will stare. And it’s normal. You’re the one who is not acting normal in that case which is why there might be consequences

Just say you disapprove. Just say you find the modern customs of your own culture to be better than theirs, and wish women could have more choice. But don't pretend to diagnose it.

Even you were right in your relativism. Who cares about kindergarten children dancing for instance?
“Of they shall not dance on music. They shall learn the one true faith”
- How can you say this is not mental illness. Well if it isn’t, than this guy hasn’t even seen a kid in his life. When I was I kid I would be angry even with logical rules imposed on me by adults. Imagine being a kid and not being able to dance on music? How healthy is that?

There is this great book written buy Umberto Eco called “The Name of the Rose”. It’s a detective / mystery novel in which a monk is invited into a 1327 İtalian monastery to solve mysterious death that are happening in this monastery. The story was also brought to the cinema in 1986 with a movie with the same name with Sean Connery playing this detective-monk William.

I really think that those who like old cinema should see it on some platform if you can. The book is also very interesting. What I really like in it (without causing any spoiler) is this constant opposition between the scholastic way of living and thinking in this medieval monastery that seems to be in constant opposition with Brother Williams more philosophical and rational (almost Cartesian) attitude. And in the end of the movie. You will see this persona, who went totally insane and started to murder because in one place he says (and that’s a spoiler) “Men do not laugh, humor is for monkeys, so ancient Greek comedies are the work of the Devil itself”.

  So that’s what I’m talking about. This is beyond religion-based superstition. This isn’t simple dogmatism or religious fanatism or zeal. If there are mental health professionals in the forum they should correct me. But banning Barbie dolls isn’t cultural. It isn’t religious either. I think the brain of this guy is not working properly. I mean what’s going to happen. What was that guy thinking of while he was making that law?

  Maybe he was seated in his balcony and he thought: “Hmmm, My Grandson Abdallah could undress that doll at some time. Than he would learn that girls have bobos and mumus. I can’t let that happen. He could become an evolutionist as a result of that! I won’t let this happen!”

- No. Their brains are not working like our brains. That’s all I am saying.