Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: February 10, 2025, 5:58 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
[Serious] Absolutes and Atheism
#80
RE: Absolutes and Atheism
(June 19, 2023 at 1:13 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote:
(June 17, 2023 at 9:13 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: I only want to know what absolutes could an atheist believe in or does atheism entail a lack of belief in absolutes. If the former give me an example of an absolute. If not the god of classical theism, what fundamental principles are available to the atheist? How can one can be an atheist and justify not being a nihilist?

I don't see what atheism has to do with anything besides whether someone believes there is really a God (or god) or not. It's one opinion on one topic, it seems to me that asking whether it entails absolutes or nonabsolutes is like asking the same thing of people who think left-handers should have more representation in public office.

But the idea that there are no absolutes sounds like a non-starter to me. The statement 'there are no absolutes' strikes me as self-contradictory, so it can't be true. However, noticing that has nothing to do with me being an atheist.

First let me say for the sake of discussion I am accepting the premise that there is no god. And I am putting aside any attempt at apologetics. I also want to challenge my own opinion that Nietzsche was right about this. IMHO he was right that the theolgical collapse of Christianity took with it the foundations of Western metaphysics. No more grand ontological naratives. No more appeals to anything beyond a Promethian will where artifice tragicly defies absurdity.

Anyways.

So we are all atheists now. Well. Now what? Where will we go and who will be our guide? Revelation is not an option. Fine, we're clear about that. We can say Reason and Reality, but as noted by the trolls, those can quickly take on numinous overtones. So we have can we be sure that by evoking reason and reality we are not tacitly drawing on theistic assumptions which go back at least as far as Plato. That doesn't leave much that was not coopted by Christianty. So what intellectual tools remain that for an atheistic philosophy. Perhaps the lack of ontology is itself hallmark of an atheistic philosophy. I do not know so I am asking the question, and it really is not a very hard one. If we are going to build a productive atheistic philosophy what are the starting points? I am pompting and listening, that's all.

That said.

Your response tacit assumes that making a self-contradictory statements is an epistemic error. It suggests a necessary assumption yet why should we suppose that strongly felt intuitions of illogicalness actually correspond meaningfully with reality. IOW why must reality be logical?
<insert profound quote here>
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 2:48 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by brewer - June 17, 2023 at 3:43 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - June 17, 2023 at 4:19 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 17, 2023 at 4:24 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 5:01 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 17, 2023 at 5:23 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 7:24 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 6:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Thumpalumpacus - June 17, 2023 at 7:51 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Fake Messiah - June 17, 2023 at 11:37 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 6:29 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 7:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 7:10 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Angrboda - June 17, 2023 at 7:36 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 9:51 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 17, 2023 at 10:12 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Angrboda - June 17, 2023 at 10:33 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 7:19 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by brewer - June 17, 2023 at 7:23 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 7:27 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by brewer - June 18, 2023 at 10:23 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 17, 2023 at 7:38 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 17, 2023 at 9:27 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Thumpalumpacus - June 17, 2023 at 7:42 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 19, 2023 at 1:08 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 17, 2023 at 8:14 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 9:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Deesse23 - June 18, 2023 at 2:03 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 19, 2023 at 1:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 19, 2023 at 9:18 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 19, 2023 at 9:26 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 19, 2023 at 9:29 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 19, 2023 at 9:54 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 20, 2023 at 9:27 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 28, 2023 at 10:49 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Deesse23 - June 29, 2023 at 2:31 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 29, 2023 at 9:00 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 29, 2023 at 9:52 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 20, 2023 at 9:12 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by brewer - June 19, 2023 at 3:56 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 9:20 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Gawdzilla Sama - June 17, 2023 at 9:20 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 17, 2023 at 9:23 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 9:59 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 17, 2023 at 10:04 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 17, 2023 at 10:11 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 17, 2023 at 10:18 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 17, 2023 at 10:10 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Gawdzilla Sama - June 17, 2023 at 11:42 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 11:12 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 10:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 17, 2023 at 11:01 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 17, 2023 at 11:02 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 17, 2023 at 11:14 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 11:38 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 17, 2023 at 11:47 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 11:53 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 17, 2023 at 11:45 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 17, 2023 at 11:49 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by emjay - June 18, 2023 at 1:36 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 18, 2023 at 2:06 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by emjay - June 18, 2023 at 6:25 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 18, 2023 at 7:07 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by emjay - June 18, 2023 at 9:00 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 18, 2023 at 9:44 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by emjay - June 18, 2023 at 11:31 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 19, 2023 at 1:06 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 18, 2023 at 12:34 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by emjay - June 18, 2023 at 1:13 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 19, 2023 at 1:17 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Architect Of Fate - June 18, 2023 at 2:33 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 18, 2023 at 3:54 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 18, 2023 at 4:21 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 18, 2023 at 9:47 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 19, 2023 at 1:00 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 19, 2023 at 1:13 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 19, 2023 at 1:18 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 18, 2023 at 10:19 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 18, 2023 at 2:31 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 18, 2023 at 9:37 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Rev. Rye - June 19, 2023 at 1:27 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Belacqua - June 19, 2023 at 1:37 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 1:43 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Angrboda - June 19, 2023 at 9:01 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 19, 2023 at 1:01 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 19, 2023 at 1:48 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 9:05 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Architect Of Fate - June 19, 2023 at 3:50 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 5:48 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 9:26 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 19, 2023 at 9:29 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 19, 2023 at 10:27 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Deesse23 - June 20, 2023 at 2:58 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 20, 2023 at 10:02 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 19, 2023 at 10:50 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 19, 2023 at 11:26 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 19, 2023 at 11:41 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Mister Agenda - June 20, 2023 at 10:34 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 11:10 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 11:19 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 19, 2023 at 11:26 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 19, 2023 at 11:28 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 20, 2023 at 3:44 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by brewer - June 20, 2023 at 7:45 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Angrboda - June 20, 2023 at 10:50 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Neo-Scholastic - June 20, 2023 at 9:41 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Silver - June 28, 2023 at 11:00 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 28, 2023 at 11:19 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Architect Of Fate - June 28, 2023 at 11:23 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 29, 2023 at 2:40 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by arewethereyet - June 29, 2023 at 6:52 am
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Anomalocaris - June 29, 2023 at 1:43 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by Astreja - June 29, 2023 at 5:59 pm
RE: Absolutes and Atheism - by The Grand Nudger - June 29, 2023 at 11:30 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Christian and Atheism Worldwide Demographics: Current Realities and Future Trends. Nishant Xavier 55 4887 July 9, 2023 at 6:07 am
Last Post: no one
  Atheism VS Christian Atheism? IanHulett 80 30734 June 13, 2017 at 11:09 am
Last Post: vorlon13
  Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True HiYou 49 13618 July 21, 2015 at 6:59 am
Last Post: KUSA
  Atheism, Scientific Atheism and Antitheism tantric 33 14127 January 18, 2015 at 1:05 pm
Last Post: helyott
  Strong/Gnostic Atheism and Weak/Agnostic Atheism Dystopia 26 13085 August 30, 2014 at 1:34 pm
Last Post: Dawsonite
  Debate share, young earth? atheism coverup? atheism gain? xr34p3rx 13 11111 March 16, 2014 at 11:30 am
Last Post: fr0d0
  Religion, Atheism, and Deism -and the middle ground. Mystic 6 3622 March 9, 2014 at 2:41 am
Last Post: rsb
  What proof and evidence is there for "atheism" to be accurate and correct? SavedByChrist94 42 23756 January 12, 2013 at 7:27 pm
Last Post: Aegrus
  A different definition of atheism. Atheism isn't simply lack of belief in god/s fr0d0 14 12698 August 1, 2012 at 2:54 pm
Last Post: Mister Agenda
  "Old" atheism, "New"atheism, atheism 3.0, WTF? leo-rcc 69 41453 February 2, 2010 at 3:29 am
Last Post: tackattack



Users browsing this thread: 14 Guest(s)