Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: July 21, 2025, 7:28 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Historical events turn into movies
#22
RE: Historical events turn into movies
(June 29, 2023 at 2:02 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: Keep in mind the strategic picture at the time of the battle of Samar is the entire imperial Japanese navy only had 68 ocean going surface combatants of all types remaining in its order of battle at the beginning the battle of Leyte gulf, and that fleet had already taken very serious further losses before the Samar engagement itself, including kurita’s own command, and kurita himself had to be fished out of the sea because his original flagship had already been sunk from under his ass.    Kurita understood that by the time his force sighted taffy, what remains of the entire imperial Japanese navy could never exploit any opportunity that might arise from any degree of immediate tactical success in phillipines.

Kurita didn’t really want to fight at Samar because he thought his remaining fleet would likely be completely annihilated in the aftermath if he pressed the attack, while even success in the attack itself could serve no strategic purpose,  So he aimed to put on a show for appearance sake but really focus on withdrawing as soon as it was seemly in order to save his ship to save his men.   But even the degree to which he could make the pretense of engaging in earnest convincing was circumscribed by the fact that his destroyers were nearing bingo fuel, due to unexpected amount of maneuvering and counter marching and then doubling back during the engagements on previous days, and he did want these destroyers make it back as well.

So it is not the tin cans beat off a greatly superior force, rather it is the greatly superior force’s commander had made up his mind to not fight, although some of his subordinate commanders were eager, they obeyed orders.

There's a lot of hindsightium in this analysis, because no American had any idea of the fuel state of the Japanese ships.

The other thing, which also requires the retrospectroscope to understand, is that after the delay in launching Sho-1, there's no way it could have worked, because by that time 6th Army had landed and had the first wave of supplies landed as well (200,000 tons of supplies!) Kurita could have kept on steaming into the now-empty supply ships had he adequate fuel (and I think he did, if he topped up DDs from BBs on return), but he still couldn't stop the invasion itself. It had already landed. But he didn't get there until 25 October, five days after the fact. The horse was already out the barn. This also requires hindsightium because no American knew the Japanese plan.

The tin cans had no idea of this either. Maybe you should call 'em and let 'em know? "Hey guys, cool your heels and let them pass, they're low on fuel and their plan is five days late anyway."

Yeah, hindsightium.

Reply



Messages In This Thread
Historical events turn into movies - by Fake Messiah - June 27, 2023 at 11:03 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 27, 2023 at 11:15 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Rev. Rye - June 28, 2023 at 3:03 am
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by brewer - June 28, 2023 at 12:04 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by brewer - June 28, 2023 at 1:33 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 29, 2023 at 12:02 am
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Thumpalumpacus - June 29, 2023 at 9:27 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 29, 2023 at 11:43 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 29, 2023 at 12:45 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 29, 2023 at 11:51 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by LinuxGal - October 21, 2023 at 4:44 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Thumpalumpacus - October 21, 2023 at 7:52 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 30, 2023 at 10:31 am
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Anomalocaris - June 30, 2023 at 11:00 am
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Fake Messiah - October 21, 2023 at 4:13 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Gawdzilla Sama - October 21, 2023 at 5:41 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Thumpalumpacus - October 21, 2023 at 7:53 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Gawdzilla Sama - October 21, 2023 at 7:55 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by LinuxGal - October 21, 2023 at 9:26 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Gawdzilla Sama - October 21, 2023 at 7:56 pm
RE: Historical events turn into movies - by Gawdzilla Sama - October 21, 2023 at 10:21 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Historical Hercules Fake Messiah 30 6292 November 9, 2024 at 5:31 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  The Historical Jesus h311inac311 252 29249 September 14, 2024 at 4:16 pm
Last Post: The Valkyrie
  historical quote/s altered or not the original?(amemrican goverment) Quill01 5 1607 July 25, 2022 at 1:57 pm
Last Post: Jehanne
  An Historical Perspective BrianSoddingBoru4 11 2628 June 18, 2019 at 12:37 am
Last Post: Anomalocaris
  Possibly the Best Historical Analogy for The WLB To Date Minimalist 6 1604 January 30, 2017 at 9:18 am
Last Post: paulpablo
Lightbulb Who's Your Favorite Historical Figure? thesummerqueen 152 22119 November 10, 2016 at 12:14 pm
Last Post: Pat Mustard
  Historical characters you admire Macoleco 52 8222 November 3, 2016 at 7:33 pm
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  The Quest for the Historical Paul Minimalist 44 10405 May 18, 2016 at 4:15 pm
Last Post: Minimalist
  Historical Standpoint Blondie 30 6743 October 22, 2015 at 5:53 pm
Last Post: Wyrd of Gawd
  Events that Led to the Civil War: Slavery as an Economic Engine Not a Moal Isssue Rhondazvous 20 9497 June 23, 2015 at 6:34 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)