RE: Isaiah 53, 700 B.C: Historical Evidence of the Divine Omniscience.
July 24, 2023 at 8:46 am
(This post was last modified: July 24, 2023 at 9:41 am by Bucky Ball.)
(July 23, 2023 at 11:30 pm)Nishant Xavier Wrote: What rubbish. Bucky, you didn't answer the two Rabbinic sources I showed that understood Isaiah 53 of the Messiah. Here is 1 again without the quote box this time: "1st Century Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai: “The meaning of the words ‘bruised for our iniquities’ [Isaiah 53:5] is, that since the Messiah bears our iniquities, which produce the effect of his being bruised, it follows that whoso will not admit that the Messiah thus suffers for our iniquities, must endure and suffer them for them himself.“
I gave clear explanations for everything and don't have to repeat myself again.
Speaking of rubbish .... I must compliment your hermeneutic of insult as the way to share your faith. Jesus would be so proud of you.
Pushing your ignorant buttons is so much fun.
“Comfort, comfort my people, says your God.
Speak tenderly to Jerusalem, and proclaim to her
that her hard service has been completed,
that her sin has been paid for,
that she has received from the Lord’s hand
double for all her sins.” —Isaiah 40:1–2
Your god seems to be rather forgetful, rather than omniscient.
(BTW there are other examples where the Bible says your god regrets doing various things ... please make another thread and we can talk about those not-so-omniscient lapses.)
You're doing "prophesy" as "omen reading" again. It was forbidden. The role of a prophet was never to "tell the future". You're entire argument is without foundation in Hebrew culture.
You're using "prophecy" in a totally inauthentic manner. You really should take Bible 101.
You explained nothing and demonstrated how totally ignorant you are of this matter.
Your Fifth Evangelist BS is totally irrelevant, but does demonstrate your problem.
The use of the singular "he" and "his" is the NATION, just as it is in context in ALL the preceding chapters.
You've wrested (LOL) this totally out of context because you work BACKWARDS. You work from what you want and need to find to support your FAITH to something you think
supports it, as you are not a scholar of anything, and are basically dishonest. Isaiah is talking in context as has been pointed out to you, the nation as a servant, not a single person.
The role of the Jewish Messiah was NEVER EVER to "die for sin".
You simply are totally ignorant of Hebrew culture and history.
The Messiah was supposed to get the Kingdom of Israel restored, not to expiate sin.
The Jews ALREADY had a temple / purification / sacrifice system which was quite satisfactory and sufficient for them. They had no need for anyone to suffer for sin.
Their priest offered sufficient sacrifices every day in the temple according to their law. They didn't need a savior.
There is nowhere the Jewish Messiah has to be sinless, or die for sin. It simply was NEVER a part of that culture, as virtually every Jew knows. You made that up.
The Messiah was supposed to arrive AT THE END OF DAYS and his tasks were not to die for sin.
You have your head so far up your Catholic ass, you can't see ANYTHING in any other context.
Even Jesus' disciples did not think he came to die for sin. Acts 1:6 "When they therefore had come together, they asked of Him, saying, 'Lord, wilt Thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?'.
They STILL went to the temple every day, AND expiation of sin was not part of that culture. It was not what the messiah had to do.
Your 1 quote from Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai proves absolutely nothing. First of all many many things had changed in Hebrew culture since the time of Isaiah.
Little things like the rise of apocalypticism, the Essenes, ... the Romans, .... LOL just little things like that, and secondly you have to prove that this guy who lived as a hermit, ... that his thought was in the MAINSTREAM. You have failed in that. That's how history works. Maybe someday you'll get an education.
https://www.jewfaq.org/mashiach
"The term "mashiach" literally means "the anointed one," and refers to the ancient practice of anointing kings with oil when they took the throne. The mashiach is the one who will be anointed as king in the End of Days."
"The word "mashiach" does not mean "savior." The notion of an innocent, divine or semi-divine being who will sacrifice himself to save us from the consequences of our own sins is a purely Christian concept that has no basis in Jewish thought. Unfortunately, this Christian concept has become so deeply ingrained in the English word "messiah" that this English word can no longer be used to refer to the Jewish concept.
It's very obvious (and widely accepted) that Isaiah had at least three authors, so I guess you're going to have to change it to the 5th, 6th and 7th evangelists. LOL
If there really only 4 evangelists and the number was limited to 4 gospels "because there are 4 winds and 4 pillars upon whish the earth stands" (Irenaeus) what about the other 2000 gospels ? LOL
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell 
Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist