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Veganism
#72
RE: Veganism
(August 28, 2024 at 11:09 am)h311inac311 Wrote: So it's almost as if humans are something more than an animal, no?
I don't think so, no.   Though it doesn't seem to me like it would matter to the moral question whether we were or weren't.  We are either animals with a moral sense or "other x"s with a moral sense?

Quote:You're saying that people have developed a capacity for moral reasoning, if what you're saying is true then wouldn't that count as evidence that our designer gave us some of his ability to Judge?
I'd say still developing, even, sure..and no.  That wouldn't be evidence that there's any designer, or that any designer gave us abilities - nor would the answers to those questions resolve the moral question.

Quote:Should we is a different question. Should we eat any food at all? It would seem that those who fast receive a blessing from God, so it is good in his sight to abstain from any food or drink so as to, "hunger and thirst after righteousness."

But we are allowed to and we are allowed to think about what this means for our species, In my view God wants to use death as a reminder for our ultimate end. Death entered into this world through sin, this means that it is our responsibility to become a master over it.
Yes, exactly, the moral question has nothing to do with those things.  Here we finally find some begining of an answer.  In your view, god did give us permission to do a bad thing, which he would apparently prefer we not do, not just with animals, but with anything - because he likes us hungry.  Because it uses death to teach us something.  Thus, it is god that is both proximately and ultimately responsible for this moral or natural evil.  

Quote:"Sin is crouching at your doorstep, waiting to devour you as a wild beast devours its un-suspecting prey. If you do well, will God not be pleased?"

Death is our ultimate end, is it bad or good? Is it good that one animal should die so that another may live?
A good question, I suppose, if death is on the table as a negotiable.  Even in the hypothetical designer scenario you have in mind it's clear that god didn't -have- to make things this way.  Herbivory and autotrophy also exist.  OFC, this is all completely natural.  A supernatural god would not in theory be limited to creating such an outcome through natural means - and yet here we are.   Thus god had the ability, and the choice - the only element we're missing for moral responsibility is whether or not god is a moral agent. Does it know right from wrong? Is it more like us, or more like other animals..in that regard?

So...is it good that some creatures have to die so that some other creatures may live..and if it isn't, who's morally responsible for that situation, in your view?
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Messages In This Thread
Veganism - by Disagreeable - August 10, 2024 at 3:18 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Valkyrie - August 10, 2024 at 3:24 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 10, 2024 at 3:47 pm
RE: Veganism - by Disagreeable - August 10, 2024 at 3:48 pm
RE: Veganism - by zebo-the-fat - August 10, 2024 at 3:47 pm
RE: Veganism - by Disagreeable - August 10, 2024 at 3:52 pm
RE: Veganism - by brewer - August 10, 2024 at 4:56 pm
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - August 10, 2024 at 4:57 pm
RE: Veganism - by no one - August 10, 2024 at 6:15 pm
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - August 10, 2024 at 6:56 pm
RE: Veganism - by Paleophyte - August 10, 2024 at 7:19 pm
RE: Veganism - by Jackalope - August 10, 2024 at 8:05 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 10, 2024 at 8:13 pm
RE: Veganism - by CuriosityBob - August 10, 2024 at 8:46 pm
RE: Veganism - by Silver - August 10, 2024 at 9:01 pm
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 1:43 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 1:52 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 2:09 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 2:24 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 2:26 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 2:34 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 2:39 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 2:44 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 2:48 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 3:05 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 3:10 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 3:43 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 3:46 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 5:12 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 5:17 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 5:20 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 5:25 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 5:29 am
RE: Veganism - by Ivan Denisovich - August 11, 2024 at 5:30 am
RE: Veganism - by MR. Macabre 666 - August 11, 2024 at 3:42 pm
RE: Veganism - by brewer - August 11, 2024 at 4:36 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 4:40 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 11, 2024 at 4:52 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 11, 2024 at 5:31 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 11, 2024 at 5:58 pm
RE: Veganism - by AFTT47 - August 12, 2024 at 12:52 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2024 at 4:15 pm
RE: Veganism - by AFTT47 - August 13, 2024 at 7:52 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2024 at 8:20 pm
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - August 13, 2024 at 8:33 pm
RE: Veganism - by Jackalope - August 13, 2024 at 8:54 pm
RE: Veganism - by AFTT47 - August 14, 2024 at 12:49 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2024 at 1:41 am
RE: Veganism - by paulpablo - August 14, 2024 at 2:16 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 14, 2024 at 5:42 am
RE: Veganism - by Fake Messiah - August 14, 2024 at 6:56 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 20, 2024 at 12:49 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2024 at 8:28 pm
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - August 14, 2024 at 10:46 pm
RE: Veganism - by Fake Messiah - August 14, 2024 at 11:36 pm
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - August 15, 2024 at 12:13 am
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - August 15, 2024 at 5:10 am
RE: Veganism - by Ahriman - August 15, 2024 at 4:31 am
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - August 14, 2024 at 8:49 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 15, 2024 at 5:29 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2024 at 11:58 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2024 at 1:01 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 20, 2024 at 12:35 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2024 at 1:34 pm
RE: Veganism - by Sheldon - August 20, 2024 at 4:09 pm
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 10:06 am
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - August 28, 2024 at 11:08 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 11:10 am
RE: Veganism - by h4ym4n - August 29, 2024 at 11:47 am
RE: Veganism - by h4ym4n - August 29, 2024 at 11:44 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2024 at 3:34 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 29, 2024 at 3:50 pm
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - September 12, 2024 at 7:18 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 28, 2024 at 10:22 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 11:09 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 28, 2024 at 11:22 am
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - August 28, 2024 at 11:17 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 11:38 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 28, 2024 at 12:31 pm
RE: Veganism - by h4ym4n - August 29, 2024 at 11:53 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 28, 2024 at 11:42 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 4:51 pm
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - August 28, 2024 at 11:42 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 28, 2024 at 12:30 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 28, 2024 at 4:56 pm
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - August 28, 2024 at 7:42 pm
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - August 28, 2024 at 7:45 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 28, 2024 at 7:47 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - August 29, 2024 at 3:50 am
RE: Veganism - by zebo-the-fat - August 29, 2024 at 6:34 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2024 at 11:00 am
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - August 29, 2024 at 7:08 pm
RE: Veganism - by Jackalope - August 29, 2024 at 7:48 pm
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - August 29, 2024 at 8:56 pm
RE: Veganism - by Silver - August 29, 2024 at 8:23 pm
RE: Veganism - by Ahriman - September 12, 2024 at 7:29 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2024 at 10:30 pm
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - August 30, 2024 at 2:06 am
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - September 12, 2024 at 7:05 am
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - September 12, 2024 at 7:36 am
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 12, 2024 at 12:27 pm
RE: Veganism - by h4ym4n - September 12, 2024 at 1:57 pm
RE: Veganism - by h311inac311 - September 14, 2024 at 1:08 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 14, 2024 at 1:22 pm
RE: Veganism - by Angrboda - September 14, 2024 at 2:13 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - September 14, 2024 at 2:43 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 14, 2024 at 3:17 pm
RE: Veganism - by h4ym4n - September 17, 2024 at 6:12 am
RE: Veganism - by arewethereyet - September 12, 2024 at 7:31 am
RE: Veganism - by Jackalope - September 14, 2024 at 2:32 pm
RE: Veganism - by MR. Macabre 666 - September 14, 2024 at 3:42 pm
RE: Veganism - by Jackalope - September 14, 2024 at 4:19 pm
RE: Veganism - by brewer - September 14, 2024 at 4:00 pm
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - September 14, 2024 at 10:15 pm
RE: Veganism - by MR. Macabre 666 - September 19, 2024 at 3:00 am
RE: Veganism - by Thumpalumpacus - September 19, 2024 at 10:00 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - September 12, 2024 at 11:53 am
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - September 12, 2024 at 12:48 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 12, 2024 at 3:54 pm
RE: Veganism - by The Grand Nudger - September 12, 2024 at 4:16 pm
RE: Veganism - by zebo-the-fat - September 14, 2024 at 2:52 pm
RE: Veganism - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 17, 2024 at 7:11 am

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