" War, what is it good for? "....Edwin Starr.

[Pippy]

So the wars of the past were legit according to you.

No. I am repeating myself now, war is never the right option. I do not believe in war. But I want to talk about modern war. It is much easier for me to try to present the argument that modern war is without merit, since historical war had a semblance of justification. So I am trying to be clear about modern war, we are talking about Afghanistan and Iraq. You retort with rhetoric about Hitler, and we are suddenly talking about two different things.

Again with the "my morality supersedes your morality".

That may very well be the case, I am a terminally moral person, but that is not what I am saying. That my morality supersedes your morality might be true, but that is inconsequential and immeasurable...

No war is 'justified'. No war is 'legitimate'. No war is 'called for'. No war can be pardoned.

Finally, we seem to agree on something. Keep on that track...

But they must be fought against those who wage such.

Arg! You were doing so good. If we are the ones who "must" fight those who wage war, are we not those who wage war? Isn't that still a system that grows exponentially worse? I am living a life that tries to progress towards a better humanity, a big part being an advocate for peace. If everyone is crazy, and war is in fasion, then I will stand with the side I chose.

I love when people make peace-mongers out to be cowards. It takes strong rhetoric. If you don't stand behind the troops, stand in front of them. My call for peace is the greatest support (from little old me) the troops can ask for.

Don't you see that the "we have to fight madmen" and "we have to fight those who fight" are states of mind where war will become bigger and bigger? Certainly not states of mind that work towards any resolution. We are responsible to not elect or allow madmen in our home country, but it is really not our business to stop them other places, especially if we are not better than them in doing so.

I know this is a touchy subject, and please don't get offended. I don't mean to say that my morality is better than yours. I just disagree, on a moral point.

You seem to believe "just" and "unjust" are defined by your personal opinion or legal concept.
Heros in a just war, murders in an unjust war. And who decides which is which? Pippy!

When I say that the wars now are unjust, I am not stating an opinion. I believe that to be the actual truth of the situation. I am much more certain about the wrongness of war, and how to get out of it, than I am about god, or any other thing I am quick to say "I think"...

I think objectively that the war is wrong. Based on logic and rationale, not on personal opinion and especially not 'legal concept'. BUT, that is an opinion. I am of the opinion that it is objective that the modern wars are wrong. Unnecessary. So it is both, and opinion and not... I get to decide when I am talking about what I think, just as you get to decide when you are talking about what you think. It is funny that you made me seem like I am being unrealistic and domineering when I am speaking about what I think. Obviously I get to decide what I think. Geez!

Thanks,
-Pip