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One less scumbag in the world
#26
RE: One less scumbag in the world
(March 1, 2012 at 6:05 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote: While discussing what ifs, here's one I'd like to ask. When I read the history, it seems to me the downfall of the German Empire (pre-WWI) was when they listened to Tripitz and started building a fleet to try to rival Britain. This seemed to me a stupid move, politically, since relations with France were pretty much screwed by the conflict over Alsalce-Lorraine and relations with Russia were bound to be chilly over the Balkan situation. Why did they want to honk off the British too? It seems to me the Kaiser could have played Britain and France against each other over their colonial rivalry, avoid building any navy and tried to build good relations with Britain. This might have avoided WWI completely.

I think you have it the other way around. The German fleet didn't drive Britain and France closer. Germany was demographically and economically much stronger than France, and British was always going to side with the French in any war in the interest of preventing a victorious Germany from marshalling the resources of a whole continent against Britain at a later date. The German fleet was an attempt to make any such British interference very costly, and prevent any British blockade of German occupied ports from becoming 100% effective.

The downfall of Germany really started when Kaiser Wilhelm II arrogantly refused to renew the reinsurance treaty with Russia in 1890. The reinsurance treaty had been Bismarck's ploy to keep Germany on good terms with Russia and thus keep France isolated on the continent. It was to the best interest of both Germany and Russia. Russia was eager to renew it, the Kaiser was advised to renew it, but declined to do so out of sheer arrogance and delusion.

He had thought that British antipathy towards Russia was such that it would transfer to Germany should Germany ally with Russia. So ironically the idiotic Kaiser thought breaking with Russia would improve relationship with Britain. So he turned down the Russians.

As it turned out, the British regarded this as indication of the Kaiser's arrogance and boundless ambition. The Russians promptly went to the French, allied with the French, and within 15 years, the Russians were also allied with the British.

It is now the Germans who were isolated. The rest is the Von Schliffen Plan, the Miracle at Marne, the Ludendorff offensive, and the treaty of Versaille.

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Messages In This Thread
One less scumbag in the world - by Minimalist - March 1, 2012 at 12:49 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by 5thHorseman - March 1, 2012 at 12:56 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Anomalocaris - March 1, 2012 at 12:57 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Minimalist - March 1, 2012 at 1:08 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Doubting Thomas - March 1, 2012 at 1:20 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Anomalocaris - March 1, 2012 at 1:22 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by kılıç_mehmet - March 1, 2012 at 1:47 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by 5thHorseman - March 1, 2012 at 2:15 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by kılıç_mehmet - March 1, 2012 at 2:48 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by reverendjeremiah - March 1, 2012 at 4:53 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Minimalist - March 1, 2012 at 2:08 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by DeistPaladin - March 1, 2012 at 2:13 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Welsh cake - March 1, 2012 at 2:32 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by paintpooper - March 1, 2012 at 2:38 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by 5thHorseman - March 1, 2012 at 4:56 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by reverendjeremiah - March 1, 2012 at 5:21 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by DeistPaladin - March 1, 2012 at 6:05 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Anomalocaris - March 1, 2012 at 6:50 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Anomalocaris - March 1, 2012 at 2:40 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by The Grand Nudger - March 1, 2012 at 2:41 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by DeistPaladin - March 1, 2012 at 3:10 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by The Grand Nudger - March 1, 2012 at 5:24 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by kılıç_mehmet - March 1, 2012 at 5:35 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by 5thHorseman - March 1, 2012 at 5:31 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by 5thHorseman - March 1, 2012 at 5:39 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by kılıç_mehmet - March 1, 2012 at 6:03 pm
RE: One less scumbag in the world - by Autumnlicious - March 1, 2012 at 6:56 pm

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