Conversion

[Jon Paul]

Your actuality/potentiality argument misses a very important point. Nobody in the scientific community (or at least in physics) is proposing that the universe came into existence/was created/has a cause/etc.

Some people do propose that something beyond this universe caused it to exist, yes (e.g. quantum physicists), but not on scientific grounds. Because to propose anything beyond the natural world would be contrary to the principle of methodological naturalism.

. Causality can be seen merely as a property springing forth from this uncreated universe- the pure actuality.

The reason this universe is not pure actuality I have outlined many times. My argument clearly shows that the universe is impure actuality, in that potentialities come into actuality within it (in time and space), and so potentiality is a fundamental part of this world. It is not pure actuality, because it doesn't meet the ontological requirements of being pure acutality.

Time, causality, logic, truth and everything else you speak of could just as easily have sprung forth from the uncaused universe as from the uncaused god. The universe's uncreated existence alone could perfectly suit your argument without invoking a sentient creator who inspires authors and gives favours to football teams.

It couldn't suit my argument, because the universe is not pure actuality, it is actualised potentiality, and we see potentiality enter into actuality all the time in it, which ontologically differentiates it from being necessary to being contingent.

If you are going to reply to this, please do it in my thread..

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*sigh* TAG. It's not logically sound, because it assumes that you have to have a consciousness in order for logical absolutes to exist, therefore bam, there's god, the ultimate consciousness. Which is bullshit, because you have to prove a consciousness has to exist for logical absolutes to exists. And TAG doesn't prove that, so it's out the window.

Nowhere does it mention consciousness in any form that I have ever seen it. So you are addressing something other than the TAG.

BUT, even if you could prove God exists with TAG, you CANNOT get to the Christian God, because you essentially prove ANY god with it and any god is not the Christian god.

Any god does not live up to the biblical doctrine of a transcendent, omniscient, immutable God which is minimally necessary for the logical coherence the TAG concludes the Christian worldview achieves in the transcendence of the conceptual reality of logical truth.