(November 24, 2008 at 1:39 pm)Tiberius Wrote: I don't think your example counts as "faith". Faith is a belief that isn't based on a proof or evidence, however in your case your belief was based on evidence. Your experience in previous cases made you believe that this was a woman who murdered the man because of the dropped gun. That to me counts as evidence and not as faith.
Adrian, you made a good point. How about this. My faith in the case of the man shot by the woman was made in faith of my past experiences. It could have turned out either way. I could have been right or wrong, but eventually my theory was proved as true, accurate and fact. The evidence I had in proposing that theory wouldn't have been solid evidence to a rookie cop and not without good reason. He hadn't the experience.
My theory was, to me, an example of the Biblical definition of faith. Hebrews 11:1 - Faith is the assured expectation ("Assured expectation." Literally "a sub-standing." Greek hypostasis; Latin substantia) of things hoped for, the evident demonstration ("Evident demonstration." Or, "convincing evidence." Greek elegkhos; Latin argumentum. Compare John 16:8) of realities (Literally "of things." Greek pragmaton) though not beheld.
That is pretty much what happened. The point, though, was that I could have been wrong. Even with the "Greek elegkhos or convincing evidence."
(November 24, 2008 at 1:39 pm)Tiberius Wrote: Another example for instance. Suppose I am in an unknown personal universe, and I have no idea how the laws of this universe works. So I take a ball and drop it. It falls upwards towards the ceiling. I do the experiment again, and the ball always drops upwards. "Aha", I think to myself, "Gravity works upside-down in this universe". I take the ball again, and prepare to drop it.
Now, I believe that the ball is going to fall upwards, because in all previous attempts (let's say there were 100 of them) it did so, and the conditions were exactly the same. When I release the ball, it could go down of course, but that isn't the question. The question is whether my belief in the ball falling upwards is based on faith or evidence. I would say evidence, and until the ball drops downwards I would continue to say it was a belief based on evidence. Once it drops down, I would have to rethink my beliefs, but up until that point I don't think it could be said to be faith.
Yeah. We have yet to see things differently as I see it so far. From my perspective at this point in our conversation the problem may be that you see faith as blind faith, which the Bible doesn't encourage. Perhaps you see that as such for personal reasons due to a mythological influence in Xianity and a scientific inability to explain the supernatural but is that what we are talking about? I don't think so.
Lets say that an unknown extra terrestrial being came down to earth and the first thing he found was a Bible, which he was able to read and understand and the supernatural acts performed in it were not an impossibility to the being?
