RE: Would you like if all people became atheists?
June 18, 2013 at 8:27 am
(This post was last modified: June 18, 2013 at 8:48 am by Fidel_Castronaut.)
My answer is for the mindset of "I believe 'x' and everyone else should as well or else" to be eliminated and destroyed in all its forms through a peaceful evolution and acceptance of the idea that 'people believe in different things, and I'm ok with that so long as they don't try to enforce their beliefs on others, or try and tell me I'm bad becuase I don't follow their beliefs'.
It doesn't matter to me that people are religious so long as they don't try and make me religious. Those that do are, in my opinion, pretty terrible people that should garner no respect from anyone.
Not forgetting of course that the treaty of Westphalia was initiated by one sect of Christians trying to wrestle state legitimacy from another sect of chrisitians.
Secularism is not about creating a sphere for atheists to control state structures and political heirarchies; never was. It's about creating a neutral sphere in said structures and heriarchies for people of all religions (and none) to have equal input into the running of the state. It's about fostering a legitimate structure elected by the people that doesn't enforce anyone else's religion onto the people, rather allows them to [not] believe whatever they want without fear of being persecuted/restricted in their [lack of] belief by a majority that doesn't [not] believe the same thing they do.
It's actually a great system that theists and atheists alike should support because it ensures that their beliefs are not supported/restricted by state sanctions. None of this was aimed at you Polaris, rather just at people who think that secularism = atheism, or that secularism = the denial or restriction of religion in every part of society.
I agree with the above and use myself as proof. I've never once been 'religious' or believed in a deity. Not since day 1 of my existence.
It doesn't matter to me that people are religious so long as they don't try and make me religious. Those that do are, in my opinion, pretty terrible people that should garner no respect from anyone.
(June 17, 2013 at 9:58 pm)Polaris Wrote: Societies that have shunned religion for secular control have been the most destructive and most dangerous to humanity.
Not forgetting of course that the treaty of Westphalia was initiated by one sect of Christians trying to wrestle state legitimacy from another sect of chrisitians.

Secularism is not about creating a sphere for atheists to control state structures and political heirarchies; never was. It's about creating a neutral sphere in said structures and heriarchies for people of all religions (and none) to have equal input into the running of the state. It's about fostering a legitimate structure elected by the people that doesn't enforce anyone else's religion onto the people, rather allows them to [not] believe whatever they want without fear of being persecuted/restricted in their [lack of] belief by a majority that doesn't [not] believe the same thing they do.
It's actually a great system that theists and atheists alike should support because it ensures that their beliefs are not supported/restricted by state sanctions. None of this was aimed at you Polaris, rather just at people who think that secularism = atheism, or that secularism = the denial or restriction of religion in every part of society.
(June 18, 2013 at 8:00 am)Maelstrom Wrote:(June 18, 2013 at 5:01 am)ideologue08 Wrote: I would also say that the knowledge of God's existence is also innate.
I have to disagree, because atheism is always the default position. The only two ways I know of for someone to learn of the concept of God is through indoctrination or creating the concept himself without help from any outside source. Unless one spends a solitary life in a cave without internet access, no television, and no books, the latter is not likely to happen.
I agree with the above and use myself as proof. I've never once been 'religious' or believed in a deity. Not since day 1 of my existence.