pineapplebunnybounce Wrote:Your entire argument was based on what "seems to you", that is "apparently", things you've "dreamed of" and not "dreamed of" and you conclude with "reliable witness over the less reliable". What have you mentioned that is at all reliable?! Sensations and observations and dreams do not come into the realm of determining reality! it merely is what the world appears to us after our brains has processed what we pick up.
And the point that morality has to exist because you've never experienced the lack of morality in dreams before. People do bad and immoral things a lot, that is a better evidence than your dreams. Does morality not exist for them? Is it a different set of morality? These are things you have to deal with before you go on with morality has to exist.
First, I did not say that morality 'has' to exist, did I? I said that morality's existence appears more clear and distinct than the existence of the physical world. I do not say that this is a proof of a god. I say only that it calls atheism into question. And this is something that at some level you recognise, I think. For note how eager you are to show that morality and atheism are compatible. You surely recognise that if morality is not compatible with atheism, atheism is less credible. Why? Because something that appears to exist will have to be said not to exist. And other things being equal a view that respects appearances is to be preferred to one that does not.
Note, I am not saying that atheism is definitely false or that morality has to exist.
I have described how things seem to me. If they do not seem that way to you, just say. I can't say how things seem to you, can I? I'm in here- in me! Now, the arguments I gave were deductively valid and so all you have to do is tell me which premise is faulty. Don't just state that it is false, either. Argue it. Present an argument that concludes with the negation of one of my premises and that has premises of its own that are more plausible than my premise. Otherwise you're just spouting hot air.
