RE: Atheism and morality
July 7, 2013 at 5:30 am
(This post was last modified: July 7, 2013 at 5:48 am by Creed of Heresy.)
This can all be summed up in a very very simplistic manner.
Personality dictates everything.
Everyone wants a nice, ordered reason as to where morality comes from in an objective sense but in truth iobjective morality just an abstract concept and there is no determining factor for it. It's just a goal, an idea, and a powerful one at that. We don't understand where morality ACTUALLY comes from right now other than just someone saying "this is bad" and someone else going "yeah it is," and then another person going "this is good" and someone else going "yeah I agree." There are reasons for it, too. Person A can say to Person B "this is bad," and Person B can say "Why is that?" And then Person A explains why he feels this way. There's always a reason for it, even if it's not concrete. It's not solid and set in stone because if it WAS, then everyone would have the same moral values, but we don't.
Disemboweling prostitutes is wrong. To pre-emptively answer the question: Because if it was me, I wouldn't want to be disemboweled. So why would I disembowel someone else? This is where my moral grounding comes from. Jack thinks disemboweling prostitutes is fun. Well, if he thinks that way, and he acts upon it, then perhaps in equal exchange someone should disembowel him. If his own disembowelment happened immediately after his disembowelment of someone else, he might suddenly think he has a reason to, well, not disembowel prostitutes. Reasonably speaking, if he spent his entire life thinking "I really want to disembowel a prostitute," he's not going to hold himself back and only give in once death is knocking on his door. He's already a psychopath. Death isn't going to give him the guts; he's gonna do it regardless.
Now, the question of course is boiled down to "where does morality come from, and how valid is it?"
Well, evolutionary biologists think it comes from group selection, but it's a topic of controversy and debate, something that hasn't yet been nailed down.
The answer, therefore, is "I don't know."
I don't know where morality comes from, I don't know why it exists, and I don't know why my own system of morality is the way it is. But I'm not about to start inventing reasons for its existence, such as "it must be god," because there is no evidence of that other than unfounded claims. And worse than not knowing something is making claims without basis, and just as bad as that is believing claims without basis, because it is taking a shortcut in the pursuit of knowledge to an easy answer for a difficult question.
Better to say "I don't know" than to say "it must be god." Because unless you are privvy to some higher level of knowledge than we all are in regards to this, you don't actually know, either. And if you ARE privvy to this knowledge and are refusing to share it...then you're an asshole and we have no reason to believe you until you actually show the information and prove it as well. And by the way, proving the information will require a lot more than just pointing at a dusty old book and saying "THIS HAS ALL THE ANSWERS!" For such a difficult question, the answer will need to be very complex and flawless at every turn for such certainty.
Personality dictates everything.
Everyone wants a nice, ordered reason as to where morality comes from in an objective sense but in truth iobjective morality just an abstract concept and there is no determining factor for it. It's just a goal, an idea, and a powerful one at that. We don't understand where morality ACTUALLY comes from right now other than just someone saying "this is bad" and someone else going "yeah it is," and then another person going "this is good" and someone else going "yeah I agree." There are reasons for it, too. Person A can say to Person B "this is bad," and Person B can say "Why is that?" And then Person A explains why he feels this way. There's always a reason for it, even if it's not concrete. It's not solid and set in stone because if it WAS, then everyone would have the same moral values, but we don't.
Disemboweling prostitutes is wrong. To pre-emptively answer the question: Because if it was me, I wouldn't want to be disemboweled. So why would I disembowel someone else? This is where my moral grounding comes from. Jack thinks disemboweling prostitutes is fun. Well, if he thinks that way, and he acts upon it, then perhaps in equal exchange someone should disembowel him. If his own disembowelment happened immediately after his disembowelment of someone else, he might suddenly think he has a reason to, well, not disembowel prostitutes. Reasonably speaking, if he spent his entire life thinking "I really want to disembowel a prostitute," he's not going to hold himself back and only give in once death is knocking on his door. He's already a psychopath. Death isn't going to give him the guts; he's gonna do it regardless.
Now, the question of course is boiled down to "where does morality come from, and how valid is it?"
Well, evolutionary biologists think it comes from group selection, but it's a topic of controversy and debate, something that hasn't yet been nailed down.
The answer, therefore, is "I don't know."
I don't know where morality comes from, I don't know why it exists, and I don't know why my own system of morality is the way it is. But I'm not about to start inventing reasons for its existence, such as "it must be god," because there is no evidence of that other than unfounded claims. And worse than not knowing something is making claims without basis, and just as bad as that is believing claims without basis, because it is taking a shortcut in the pursuit of knowledge to an easy answer for a difficult question.
Better to say "I don't know" than to say "it must be god." Because unless you are privvy to some higher level of knowledge than we all are in regards to this, you don't actually know, either. And if you ARE privvy to this knowledge and are refusing to share it...then you're an asshole and we have no reason to believe you until you actually show the information and prove it as well. And by the way, proving the information will require a lot more than just pointing at a dusty old book and saying "THIS HAS ALL THE ANSWERS!" For such a difficult question, the answer will need to be very complex and flawless at every turn for such certainty.