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John the Baptist
#20
RE: John the Baptist
(September 6, 2013 at 1:17 pm)John V Wrote:
Quote:Apologists try to claim that Antipas stole his brother's wife while Philip was still alive, pushing the dates of JtB's imprisonment to 27 CE. The three problems here, aside from this being an unsubstantiated ad hoc,
This is from wiki, so take it with a grain of salt:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herodias#Marriages
Quote:According to Josephus:

Herodias took upon her to confound the laws of our country, and divorced herself from her husband while he was alive, and was married to Herod Antipas[5]


From the same Wiki article....

Quote:Herod Antipas (born - before 20 BC; died - after 39 AD) was also the son of Herod the Great by his fourth wife, Malthace, and half-brother of Herod II. He was a ruler of Galilee and Perea, who bore the title of tetrarch ("ruler of a quarter"). He is best known today for accounts in the New Testament of his role in events that led to the executions of John the Baptist and Jesus of Nazareth.

Antipas divorced his first wife Phasaelis, the daughter of King Aretas IV of Nabatea, in favor of Herodias. According to the New Testament Gospels, it was John the Baptist's condemnation of this arrangement that led Antipas to have him arrested; John was subsequently put to death. Besides provoking his conflict with the Baptist, the tetrarch's divorce added a personal grievance to previous disputes with Aretas over territory on the border of Perea and Nabatea. The result was a war that proved disastrous for Antipas; a Roman counter-offensive was ordered by Tiberius, but abandoned upon that emperor's death in 37 AD.

Phillip - or Herod II - or Herod Phillip apparently all the same person, died without a son which would have meant that his "kingdom" would have reverted to direct Roman rule. The marriage between Antipas and Herodias was meant to forestall that and unite the two territories under Antipas. For whatever reason, it seemed to be Roman policy whenever they could get away with it to have a member of the Herodian family ruling in Palestine. This would have been a marriage of state and Tiberius' approval would have been required. Josephus recounts that Antipas duly sailed to Rome and obtained that approval. BTW, these people would have been pushing 60 in a time when 60 was an advanced age. The idea that this was some sort of passionate love match is ridiculous. Like many state marriages, this was about money and power.

The situation is also not helped by the tendency of that dynasty to stick the name "Herod" onto everyone else's name or use the feminine form (Herodias) when it suited them. Rather than try to sort that nonsense out it is simply easier to keep track of what the Romans were doing as we have coins, inscriptions and historical references for them.
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Messages In This Thread
John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 11:13 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 11:53 am
RE: John the Baptist - by ronedee - September 6, 2013 at 12:55 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:03 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by ronedee - September 6, 2013 at 1:04 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by ronedee - September 6, 2013 at 1:07 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:11 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:33 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 6, 2013 at 12:22 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 12:55 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:29 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 1:47 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:54 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 2:16 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 2:31 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 2:51 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 2:57 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:30 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 6:12 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 9:02 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 7, 2013 at 2:23 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 7, 2013 at 3:00 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 7, 2013 at 5:08 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 7, 2013 at 6:46 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 8, 2013 at 6:28 am
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 8, 2013 at 9:35 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Tonus - September 9, 2013 at 8:46 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 12:50 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 8, 2013 at 1:10 am
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 8, 2013 at 10:19 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 9, 2013 at 9:32 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 6, 2013 at 12:56 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by ronedee - September 6, 2013 at 12:59 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:06 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:09 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:12 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 6, 2013 at 1:17 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 1:42 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:50 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 1:43 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 2:01 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 2:32 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 3:40 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 6, 2013 at 3:56 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 3:57 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 6:15 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 6, 2013 at 9:22 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 6, 2013 at 10:07 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 7, 2013 at 5:09 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 8, 2013 at 2:35 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 8, 2013 at 3:16 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 8, 2013 at 10:07 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 9, 2013 at 12:20 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 8, 2013 at 3:04 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 8, 2013 at 10:31 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 8, 2013 at 10:39 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 8, 2013 at 10:51 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Jackalope - September 8, 2013 at 11:04 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 9, 2013 at 12:39 am
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 9, 2013 at 9:20 am
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 9:47 am
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 9, 2013 at 12:32 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 12:51 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 9, 2013 at 1:08 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 1:47 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by John V - September 9, 2013 at 3:03 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 9, 2013 at 1:12 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 9, 2013 at 2:46 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 3:01 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by bladevalant546 - September 9, 2013 at 3:06 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 3:13 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by bladevalant546 - September 9, 2013 at 3:28 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Vicki Q - September 10, 2013 at 6:32 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by max-greece - September 9, 2013 at 2:49 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 2:54 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by bladevalant546 - September 9, 2013 at 2:57 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by DeistPaladin - September 9, 2013 at 3:07 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 9, 2013 at 4:22 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 10, 2013 at 8:13 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Vicki Q - September 11, 2013 at 5:24 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 10, 2013 at 8:13 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Tonus - September 11, 2013 at 5:28 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Bad Writer - September 11, 2013 at 10:21 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Drich - September 11, 2013 at 2:46 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 11, 2013 at 3:05 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 11, 2013 at 5:57 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Vicki Q - September 12, 2013 at 6:07 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 12, 2013 at 8:53 pm
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 14, 2013 at 11:01 am
RE: John the Baptist - by Minimalist - September 26, 2013 at 3:23 pm

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