Genocide in the Old Testament

[John V]

So, as an omnipotent programmer who determines the outcome of anything I am unable to cause something to feel pain without giving it free will first?

You're unable to give anything autonomous existence. "I think, therefore I am." Except in this case, I don't think, and neither do you. Therefore we are not.

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Perfection isn't perfection....what?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/perfect?s=t
Perfect means "conforming absolutely to the description or definition of an ideal type." Atheists and the Bible do not agree on what constitutes an ideal type.

Are you saying that God met the standard of perfection back in the day but it is not fair to expect him to meet the standards of perfection we have now?

I'm saying there is no such thing as "the" standard of perfection either then or now, i.e. there's no one standard that everyone agrees on.

Obviously I don't want to put you in an embarrassing position here - if you can't explain it I will understand (and feel better about myself as it is totally beyond me).

I don't know how to dumb it down further for you.

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Food animals are not killed as a result of a person really enjoying the act of ending an animal's life. Whether or not a person could eat something else (and, for many people, it's really not an option), it also isn't a deliberate act of malice on the part of the person who either kills or eats it. So, not murder.

OK, now you're altering point 3 below, as the original leads to complete hypocrisy on your part.

You don't seem to know any hunters. Plenty of them enjoy taking another animal's life. They're generally not called murderers for this. So, even if you can show that god enjoys killing (despite his express statement that he doesn't), you have the same problem.

You are the one who is dodging, because the key to this entire discussion is why God kills when it is obvious he cannot face a situation where it is necessary. God doesn't need to eat, or compete for resources. He has an infinity of options available to him if he needs to make something happen. You justify God's murderous rages by citing his ultimate intelligence.

No, I personally believe that god as creator has right to do as he pleases with his creation. You guys justify god based on intelligence when you justify our actions based on our intelligence.

If relatively greater intelligence justifies killing, then should it not be a crime for a person to kill another person who is less intelligent?

Uh, no, logic would say just the opposite.

What about babies or small children, whose brains have not developed enough to put them on your level? How much of a gap must there be to justify killing the lesser creature, and on what basis do you make that determination?

Those are questions I considered asking you guys. Ants are OK, cattle are OK, dogs aren't - it's somewhat arbitrary and self-serving. Dogs kiss our ass, so they're exempt, unless they turn on us - then they're toast.

We can't eat without killing something, be it plant or animal or fungus. That's unfortunate. But, then again, isn't that how your God designed it?

Yes. That's why it's generally OK to kill animals but not people.