Can objective morality exist in Atheism?

[objectivitees]

[quote='objectivitees' pid='56744' dateline='1266533751']

Of course it matters, it matters to US,

Yeah, but so what if it matters to you? Why is your version of what matters any more important than someone else's version which happens to oppose yours?

It matters to the vast majority, that's why the society holds this majority view as moral. We may not consider the majority view of people in another time, place or culture as moral, but that is based on our own societal norms and neither are objectively true, the best we can do is attempt to reason that one position is demonstrably superior and if this is shown then societies will often adapt morally to allow these new ideologies, the history of slavery or oppression of women would be prime examples of this.

The vast majority of people on earth hold the same basic moral core, the one we evolved with genetically as social animals - yes there are always exceptions, people who come to display different moral decisions be it minor or major, this can either be genetic or environmental factors that leads to this divergence, such as someone compelled to murder or steal, but they know that society does not condone this behaviour and there are serious consequences for doing so, it may be something that they cannot control, but that does not mean that society should allow it at all, actions deemed immoral will be frowned upon if minor (such as right-wing Christians frowning on homosexuals) or punished if serious (such as murder).



Yo, void man... I already pointed out that there are repercussions for those who don't conform to societal norms. So, I really don't get why you keep repeating this point as if it will spark some realization in me, and lead me to finally get your point. my point in saying that is, that you aren't understanding my goal here. The question is why? Why does it matter when every individual or society gets to choose their morality, if one or the other is offended? If morals are subjective, as you claim, then no one's morals are "superior" to anyone else's. I ask "why" in an attempt to get you, the Atheist to justify your moral values as a rhetorical exercise to demonstrate to you it is not possible given your presuppositions. If all moral values are equal, then in effect, there can be no justification for any of them over and against any other moral value. Why is what you believe "better" or "good" or "superior to" or "preferable" to any other set of moral values? If you say it's for "survival", I'll just ask what makes "survival" a "preferable" condition when it matters not whether you survive in the struggle, or someone or something else does. In the end, something will survive, or not, and none of it will matter where there are no moral values. There will only be what there is.

It doesn't matter whether or not it's acceptable, only that it is.

Exactly.

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What you don't seem to understand is that survival and morality have very much in common

And what you don't seem to understand is that no matter what commonalities you think you see, they are still not the same thing.