RE: Atheist arguments and the morality of God.
April 7, 2014 at 5:26 pm
(April 7, 2014 at 5:07 pm)coldwx Wrote: I think you know quite well the meaning of omnibenevolent and it seems as if you are deliberately being obtuse. As a son of a pastor, I know full well that this notion is a foundation of faith for many christians.
I don't defend the beliefs of other Christians very often. If you have a Biblical argument, please present it.
Quote:The anecdote you use does not persuade me since I believe it to be on unequal footing. You say on the one had that we can't compare human morals to god's but then make an anecdotal comparison.
I didn't say that we can't compare human morals to god's. I said that our morals regarding suffering are not unlike god's, and that the problem is that we have an inaccurate view of our own morality as judged by our actions.
Quote:And it seems to me God does do this in that a serial killer can receive eternal life simply by truly believing and repenting. So for me it would be like going into court and simply saying "I am sorry" and then you go free. Bad analogy for me personally.
The difference is that Christ paid the penalty for him. You can disagree with substitution if you like, but Biblically, no, the punishment was carried out.
Quote:So it can be argued but you acknowledge it's failure as an argument?
No, I just don't use it because it's been done to death.
Quote:I am having trouble seeing a difference from the way you have described not seeing the avoidance and therefore do not see it as unsupported. I would agree there is a knee jerk reaction so I am happy to see you have thought it through...I do not agree that there is not much of an argument. By the way I do enjoy these conversations. I am new here and this is exactly why I joined. Thanks for thoughtful discussions even though we disagree.
Once you take away omnibenevolence, there's no contradiction in attributes, and so no POE or POS. You may decide you wouldn't want to worship such a being, but that's not a problem for me, and in fact weakens the POS/POE in that they're shown to be justifications rather than causes.
