(June 6, 2014 at 12:31 pm)Godschild Wrote:(June 6, 2014 at 2:07 am)Irrational Wrote: Correct, but it does mean that there are things secular organizations could improve on.
Regardless, I'm still skeptical about what Godschild says based on the fact that they're claims based on self-reports mainly. And correlation is not equal to causation anyway.
I've personally seen the results of these two organizations, but most here believe me to be a liar so they want accept this. No one has ever shown I've ever lied to them though, funny how one can be called a liar without proof. The site I posted was by Teen Challenge but, the study was an independent one and if you go and look at the sites that criticize them and you will see that they show success rates much higher than the secular organizations. The biggest thing wrong with the secular organizations is money, they deal with insurance companies and with most if you do not have the money for the program you do not get in. The biggest grip I have with them is they have 30 to 90 day stays, not enough time, just not enough, addictions generally are years in the making and it takes time to battle time. Don't just doubt what I say, if you're interested in tearing down this organization do research, if you are interested in it's success do research.
GC
The file you linked to shows that the studies, in general, were mainly based on self-report.
The first study made use of self-report and urinalysis tests. However, it seems urinalysis tests could be passed with relative ease even if one does drugs.
The rest are purely based on self-report.
In addition, I have not seen a study from you showing that secular organizations pale in comparison to Christian ones with regards to treating drug addiction.
Furthermore, I'm skeptical that any of the studies in the file are independent.
If my skepticism offends you, my bad. But properly conducted experiments are what make me relatively confident of any cause and effect claim. And especially if they are published in legit and relevant journals.