(February 18, 2015 at 10:46 pm)Aractus Wrote:(February 18, 2015 at 1:49 pm)Surgenator Wrote: If temperatures had stayed the same, some ice will melt and some water will freeze. There would be an equilibrium between the two processes like we observed in the 18th and 19th century. You have to explain why the glaciers are not growing as fast as they're melting (on average). Why can't the climate not sustain them?
"All ice bodies on Kilimanjaro have retreated drastically between 1912–2003. Despite air temperatures always being below freezing, areal retreat of plateau glaciers is governed mostly by solar radiation induced melt on vertical walls that characterize their north and south margins [Mölg et al., 2003]. Though the processes responsible for the formation of the vertical walls is still not well understood, once established, the vertical wall retreat is irreversible, and no change in 20th century climate appears to have significantly altered their ongoing demise.
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"Rather than changes in 20th century climate being responsible for their demise, glaciers on Kilimanjaro appear to be remnants of a past climate that was once able to sustain them."
So let me get this straight. I state that there was an equilibrium in the 18th and 19th century. So to counter my claim, you quote something that happened in the 20th ad 21st century. You're at least a century off. However, I will admit that I oversimplified how glaziers behave and jumped to an unjustified conclusion. I will like to point out that I was originally talking about ice in general not specifically glaciers. Nevertheless, glacier formation/erosion depend on more than just the air temperature. Rainfall, vertical walls, dust/ash and solar radiation also have to be taken into account. Finally, the little ice age (1300-1800) caused glaciers to advance well beyond previous regions. So we would expect glaciers to recede following the little ice age.
Getting back on topic, you cannot explain the recent changes.
Quote:Consistent with most mountain glaciers worldwide, glaciers in the tropical Andes have been retreating at an increasing rate since the late 1970s. The rate of currentAnd also what is happening to glaciers on a global scale.
retreat appears to be unprecedented since the LIA maximum, i.e. since the second half of the 17th century and the early 18th century.
Quote:After 1975, glacier shrinkage continues to accelerate until present. The mass loss from 1996 to 2005 is more than double the mass loss rate in the previous decade of 1986 to 1995 and over four times the mass loss rate over 1976 to 1985. When you narrowly focus on a few cherry picked glaciers, you can be misled into an incorrect view of global glacier trends. When you take in the broader picture, you see that globally, glaciers are shrinking at an accelerating rate.
The ice is melting faster than normal. Care to give a hypothesis on what such a driven force could be. Those deep ocean currents would have a tough time reaching glaciers located on mountains. Unless there was some positive feedback mechanism.
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