Atheist only discussion of morality.

[TheDarkestOfAngels]

But I'm not discussing prosocial behavior as the basis for modern law and policy. I'm talking to people who sincerely believe that some things are literally and empirically right or wrong regardless of social or individual benefits or detriments.

Oh I see.
I wasn't saying it was the basis for law and policy (though I did make mention of it) - I was trying to make an arguement on an evolutionary/sociological basis in the sense of human relationships. I suppose I could make the arguement that that is the empiricism of a 'right' or 'wrong' in the sense that, among humans, it's virtually universal that murder is 'wrong' so it essentially becomes a self-fufilling natural law. Though that's a long stretch assuming it even has any merit at all.

In other words, somthing is right or wrong entirely because we consider something to be wrong, I'm trying to say, but again this arguement is somethign of a stretch to fit the arguement you're making.

I suppose I agree because it seems to be that you're making the arguement against the idea that there is an actual natural law governing morality, which is what I assume you mean by "empirical objective morality." Mostly because it seems to be the same idea as 'divine law' governing morality that is intrinsic upon all life under god's creation except the explaination is naturalistic. Though that's my current interpretation of your arguement.

Though honestly I think you need to explain a little more on the topic here because the details seem vague to me if the above isn't true.