RE: Disproving The Resurrection By The Maximal Facts Approach
June 30, 2015 at 5:12 pm
(This post was last modified: June 30, 2015 at 5:17 pm by tonechaser77.)
There are so many contradictions inside the story of Jesus that you can't help but wonder what the hell was going on here. Many of these contradictions occur because of fighting sects of believers (Gnostics, Marcionites, Nicenes, etc) attempting to disprove the other by blatantly 'adding too' and 'taking away'. It's a big mess that takes an enormous amount of untangling.
--Does this sound like the doing of a perfect god?
--Would a god who wanted to be in relationship, through his son, with us, provide such controversial evidence of his existence, even controversial evidence of the existence of his son?
--If a god existed and wanted to be in harmony with humans by sending a savior to eradicate sin, don't you think he would at least prevent human minds from contradicting one another to prevent such confusion on whether he really existed at all? Or all the actions he performed while on earth?
The evidence should be non-falsifiable in all points. God shouldn't need a human being to defend his story because of his own stupidity in allowing us to fuck it up.
...Some issues that I'm framing from all the discussion in this thread...
Where was Jesus at the sixth hour on the day of the crucifixion?
- On the cross (Mark 15:23)
-In Pilates court (John 19:14)
Did Jesus ascend to Paradise the same day of the crucifixion?
-Yes He said to the thief who defended him, Today you will be with me in Paradise (Luke 23:43)
-No. He said to Mary Magdelene two days later, I have not yet ascended to the Father (John 20:17)
-No. ...that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the scriptures (I Cor. 15:4)
Was Jesus crucified on the daytime before the Passover meal or the daytime after?
-After (Mark 14:12-17)
-Before. Before the feast of the Passover (John 1) Judas went out at night (John 13:30). The other disciples thought he was going out to buy supplies to prepare for the Passover meal (John 13:29). When Jesus was arrested, the Jews did not enter Pilates judgment hail because they wanted to stay clean to eat the Passover (John 18:28). When the judgment was pronounced against Jesus, it was about the sixth hour on the day of Preparation for the Passover (John 19:14)
A large stone was placed at the entrance of the tomb. Where was the stone when the women arrived?
--They saw that the stone was Rolled back (Mark 16:4) They found the stone rolled away from the tomb (Luke 24:2) They saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb (John 20:1)
--As the women approached, an angel descended from heaven, rolled away the stone, and conversed with the women. Matthew made the women witness the spectacular rolling away of the stone (Matthew 28:1-6)
When did Mary Magdelene first meet the resurrected Jesus? And how did she react?
--Mary and the other women met Jesus on their way back from their first and only visit to the tomb. They took hold of his feet and worshipped him (Matthew 28:9)
--On her second visit to the tomb Mary met Jesus just outside the tomb. When she saw Jesus she did not recognize him. She mistook him for the gardener. She still thinks that Jesus body is laid to rest somewhere and she demands to know where. But when Jesus said her name she at once recognized him and called him Teacher. Jesus said to her, Do not hold me... (John 20:11 to 17)
I apologize for being crass but wake the fuck up people. Use your damn REASONING. How many times do we have to disprove the same stories over and over and over again?
--Does this sound like the doing of a perfect god?
--Would a god who wanted to be in relationship, through his son, with us, provide such controversial evidence of his existence, even controversial evidence of the existence of his son?
--If a god existed and wanted to be in harmony with humans by sending a savior to eradicate sin, don't you think he would at least prevent human minds from contradicting one another to prevent such confusion on whether he really existed at all? Or all the actions he performed while on earth?
The evidence should be non-falsifiable in all points. God shouldn't need a human being to defend his story because of his own stupidity in allowing us to fuck it up.
...Some issues that I'm framing from all the discussion in this thread...
Where was Jesus at the sixth hour on the day of the crucifixion?
- On the cross (Mark 15:23)
-In Pilates court (John 19:14)
Did Jesus ascend to Paradise the same day of the crucifixion?
-Yes He said to the thief who defended him, Today you will be with me in Paradise (Luke 23:43)
-No. He said to Mary Magdelene two days later, I have not yet ascended to the Father (John 20:17)
-No. ...that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the scriptures (I Cor. 15:4)
Was Jesus crucified on the daytime before the Passover meal or the daytime after?
-After (Mark 14:12-17)
-Before. Before the feast of the Passover (John 1) Judas went out at night (John 13:30). The other disciples thought he was going out to buy supplies to prepare for the Passover meal (John 13:29). When Jesus was arrested, the Jews did not enter Pilates judgment hail because they wanted to stay clean to eat the Passover (John 18:28). When the judgment was pronounced against Jesus, it was about the sixth hour on the day of Preparation for the Passover (John 19:14)
A large stone was placed at the entrance of the tomb. Where was the stone when the women arrived?
--They saw that the stone was Rolled back (Mark 16:4) They found the stone rolled away from the tomb (Luke 24:2) They saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb (John 20:1)
--As the women approached, an angel descended from heaven, rolled away the stone, and conversed with the women. Matthew made the women witness the spectacular rolling away of the stone (Matthew 28:1-6)
When did Mary Magdelene first meet the resurrected Jesus? And how did she react?
--Mary and the other women met Jesus on their way back from their first and only visit to the tomb. They took hold of his feet and worshipped him (Matthew 28:9)
--On her second visit to the tomb Mary met Jesus just outside the tomb. When she saw Jesus she did not recognize him. She mistook him for the gardener. She still thinks that Jesus body is laid to rest somewhere and she demands to know where. But when Jesus said her name she at once recognized him and called him Teacher. Jesus said to her, Do not hold me... (John 20:11 to 17)
I apologize for being crass but wake the fuck up people. Use your damn REASONING. How many times do we have to disprove the same stories over and over and over again?
**Crickets** -- God