I wrote..
but we infer a cause because the overwhelming majority of things (if indeed not all things) that begin to exist can be traced back to a cause. Even though there is no direct evidence of blackholes (they can't be directly observed or tested) the indirect evidence of their existence is strong enough that the existence of black holes has been established as fact. I don't want to turn this into the case for theism argument...I've already done that. There are facts and evidence (the existence of the universe, the existence of life, the existence of sentient life, the fact that conditions that allowed our existence obtained) that provide a basis for hypothesizing the existence of a Creator who intentionally caused the universe for the purpose of sentient life.
This is an interesting point. Many atheists seem to think that by eliminating the existence of God they have eliminated a magical or miraculous cause to the existence of the universe and sentient life. But have they? Is the fact of our existence made any less miraculous if we owe our existence to mindless forces that for some reason burped into existence and then without plan or intent or design caused something totally unlike itself to exist, life and sentience. If God doesn't exist humans are in fact gods in that we (unlike everything else) can act volitionally. Where as all other events occur in reaction to some other event, we alone can cause an event to occur. This is ironic because atheism is the disbelief in God and gods yet according to atheism mindless forces without plan or intent created gods.
Lets look at it another way. Suppose we had never seen a computer before and we came stumbled across one. Which explanation for its existence would be more or less miraculous (or magical); that it was creating intentionally by a more complex and intelligent designer or that mindless forces without plan or intent to create such a device stumbled into making one by some process of time and chance? Bottom line is the sentiment I often here from atheists is that by eliminating God we reduce the explanation of our existence to some natural (but unknown cause) and somehow that removes the magical or miraculous out of the equation. If atheists really dared to free think about it...they'd realize their counter explantion is no less magical.
Oh almost forgot to mention.
Well first off I don't know that a Creator creating and desiging the universe intentionally is a case of what we call magic...but how do you know some miraculous explanation isn't needed?
but we infer a cause because the overwhelming majority of things (if indeed not all things) that begin to exist can be traced back to a cause. Even though there is no direct evidence of blackholes (they can't be directly observed or tested) the indirect evidence of their existence is strong enough that the existence of black holes has been established as fact. I don't want to turn this into the case for theism argument...I've already done that. There are facts and evidence (the existence of the universe, the existence of life, the existence of sentient life, the fact that conditions that allowed our existence obtained) that provide a basis for hypothesizing the existence of a Creator who intentionally caused the universe for the purpose of sentient life.
Quote:Huge leap of faith there at the end, why go the magic route it isn't needed?
This is an interesting point. Many atheists seem to think that by eliminating the existence of God they have eliminated a magical or miraculous cause to the existence of the universe and sentient life. But have they? Is the fact of our existence made any less miraculous if we owe our existence to mindless forces that for some reason burped into existence and then without plan or intent or design caused something totally unlike itself to exist, life and sentience. If God doesn't exist humans are in fact gods in that we (unlike everything else) can act volitionally. Where as all other events occur in reaction to some other event, we alone can cause an event to occur. This is ironic because atheism is the disbelief in God and gods yet according to atheism mindless forces without plan or intent created gods.
Lets look at it another way. Suppose we had never seen a computer before and we came stumbled across one. Which explanation for its existence would be more or less miraculous (or magical); that it was creating intentionally by a more complex and intelligent designer or that mindless forces without plan or intent to create such a device stumbled into making one by some process of time and chance? Bottom line is the sentiment I often here from atheists is that by eliminating God we reduce the explanation of our existence to some natural (but unknown cause) and somehow that removes the magical or miraculous out of the equation. If atheists really dared to free think about it...they'd realize their counter explantion is no less magical.
Oh almost forgot to mention.
Quote:why go the magic route it isn't needed?
Well first off I don't know that a Creator creating and desiging the universe intentionally is a case of what we call magic...but how do you know some miraculous explanation isn't needed?
