Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: April 28, 2024, 11:07 am

Thread Rating:
  • 3 Vote(s) - 4.67 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell
#8
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell
(December 1, 2008 at 6:04 am)Kyuuketsuki Wrote:
(November 30, 2008 at 11:03 am)Daystar Wrote: We are all sinners ...

I'm not.

Kyu

The Hebrew word for sin is chattath and the Greek is hamartia, in verb form (chatta and hamartano) it means to miss, in the sense of missing a goal, way or mark. At Judges 20:16 chatta is used with a negative to describe the Benjamites who were 'slingers of stones to a hairbreadth and would not miss.' Greek writers often used hamartano referring to spearmen missing his target.

So sin means to miss the mark set by someone. If you are late for work you have sinned against your boss. If you miss your son's birthday party you have sinned against your son.

Given the definition of what sin is and what it means to sin, how is it that you are not a sinner?
(December 1, 2008 at 7:11 am)Darwinian Wrote: If we are all sinners then we were deliberately made that way and cannot accept any responsibility ourselves.

Gene Roddenberry said it best with..

"We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes."

We were not deliberately made that way. To sin means to miss the mark, in this case set by God. Adam decided that he was the one to judge what is right and wrong rather than the creator and that not only was a stupid move but it also produced results other than death.

That rejection of God and his protection and guidence. Roddenberry's viewpoint was distorted by religious nonsense.
(December 1, 2008 at 7:37 am)Tiberius Wrote: Of course the argument against that is that we rebelled against God, it was our choice. The problem with this is that punishment for this rebellion is ridiculous, seeing as God gave us our freedom in the first place. If you give someone something and they use it against you, then the fault is at least joint, if not entirely yours.

There is more to it than that we rebelled and were punished. It was a simple thing. They had one regulation and they screwed it up.

Think about this. Adam was in charge, he was given charge over all the earth, animals and his wife. The angel later known as Satan was put in charge of protecting the Garden. Paradise was a small portion of Earth that God had prepared for them, and outside of that small area the earth was knew and uninhabitable.

The angel later known as Satan deceived Eve, but since Adam had been put in charge there is the possibility that he could have stopped it. Adam, on the other hand - who, I remind you had been put in charge of Earth under the angel's protection - was not deceived. He knew better and could have stopped it.

He chose to reject God and rise above him in judging what was right and what was wrong.

Now a very important thing to consider is that all of the spirit creatures in heaven are watching this all unfold. They are thinking is it possible that man knows better than God what is right or wrong? Would it not be fair to give them the opportunity to do so?

A great deal of what the Bible skeptic perceives as being evil punishment from God is actually more a result of them pushing him out of the picture. Adam chose - that is what the Bible says whether you see the Bible as fable or truth. If, though, it is truth, you continue to do the same as Adam before you, so sin is not so hard to see and believe once you know what it is.
(December 1, 2008 at 9:18 am)Darwinian Wrote: And the argument against that is that God knew exactly what would happen before he created anything but he still went ahead with his creation anyway. Therefore, knowing what the outcome would be he must hold sole responsibility.

After all, you wouldn't test a new alarm system in a busy airport if you knew that the result would be a stampede with hundreds of people crushed to death would you. And if you did you couldn't then blame people for panicking!

That is the thing. There is no scriptural support that God knew what would happen before he created anything, and in fact, to me it doesn't even make sense to think that the did.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - November 29, 2008 at 7:06 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - November 30, 2008 at 4:46 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - November 30, 2008 at 11:03 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 1, 2008 at 11:02 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 1, 2008 at 4:51 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 2, 2008 at 11:33 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 3, 2008 at 3:19 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Darwinian - December 1, 2008 at 7:11 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Tiberius - December 1, 2008 at 7:37 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Darwinian - December 1, 2008 at 9:18 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Darwinian - December 1, 2008 at 2:21 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 1, 2008 at 4:10 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 1, 2008 at 5:50 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 2, 2008 at 12:19 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Tiberius - December 1, 2008 at 6:45 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 1, 2008 at 10:53 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 2, 2008 at 6:43 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Tiberius - December 2, 2008 at 4:55 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 2, 2008 at 5:02 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by leo-rcc - December 2, 2008 at 5:13 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Kyuuketsuki - December 2, 2008 at 11:08 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 3, 2008 at 8:00 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 3, 2008 at 11:41 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 3, 2008 at 11:51 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 4, 2008 at 12:03 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 4, 2008 at 11:20 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 4, 2008 at 12:23 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 4, 2008 at 1:37 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 4, 2008 at 1:56 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 4, 2008 at 3:14 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 4, 2008 at 5:48 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 4, 2008 at 7:13 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 4, 2008 at 5:59 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Dotard - December 4, 2008 at 11:12 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 4, 2008 at 11:28 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 11:46 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Kyuuketsuki - December 5, 2008 at 12:01 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 12:19 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Ace Otana - December 5, 2008 at 12:45 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 1:11 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 5, 2008 at 1:59 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Ace Otana - December 5, 2008 at 1:18 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 1:20 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Ace Otana - December 5, 2008 at 1:21 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 1:23 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Ace Otana - December 5, 2008 at 1:24 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 5, 2008 at 1:25 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Ace Otana - December 5, 2008 at 1:33 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 5:25 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 5, 2008 at 5:33 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 5:38 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 5, 2008 at 5:42 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 5, 2008 at 10:14 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by LukeMC - December 6, 2008 at 9:28 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Tiberius - December 6, 2008 at 8:18 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Kyuuketsuki - December 6, 2008 at 11:55 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 6, 2008 at 12:05 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 9, 2008 at 8:31 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 9, 2008 at 11:49 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 9, 2008 at 11:54 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 10, 2008 at 12:57 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 10, 2008 at 11:31 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 9, 2008 at 10:48 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 9, 2008 at 11:46 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by lukec - December 10, 2008 at 2:52 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 10, 2008 at 3:20 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Kyuuketsuki - December 11, 2008 at 7:30 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 11, 2008 at 12:09 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Kyuuketsuki - December 12, 2008 at 6:45 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 13, 2008 at 2:44 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by CoxRox - December 13, 2008 at 2:59 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 13, 2008 at 8:09 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 13, 2008 at 8:23 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 13, 2008 at 8:41 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Edwardo Piet - December 14, 2008 at 12:44 am
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 14, 2008 at 2:10 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Tiberius - December 13, 2008 at 10:05 pm
RE: What The Bible Really Teaches About Hell - by Daystar - December 14, 2008 at 12:14 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Two verses on hell from the bible purplepurpose 7 641 June 15, 2023 at 10:25 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Without citing the bible, what marks the bible as the one book with God's message? Whateverist 143 44142 March 31, 2022 at 7:05 am
Last Post: Gwaithmir
  Did Moses really write the first few books of the bible? T.J. 30 2158 November 19, 2021 at 10:39 pm
Last Post: Brian37
  Who goes to hell - as far as those pious Bible Christians are concerned? Dundee 71 6605 June 14, 2020 at 12:41 pm
Last Post: Paleophyte
  What the bible says Hell is like sinnerdaniel94 843 126641 September 11, 2016 at 6:08 pm
Last Post: Arkilogue
  What the Hell,is Hell anyway? Vern Cliff 31 6999 October 15, 2015 at 1:17 pm
Last Post: brewer
  People Don't Go to Hell in the Bible Rhondazvous 53 16111 August 5, 2015 at 3:17 pm
Last Post: orangebox21
  Illinois bible colleges: "We shouldn't have to follow state standards because bible!" Esquilax 34 7451 January 23, 2015 at 12:29 pm
Last Post: Spooky
  Hell Houses (AKA: Hallelujah Houses, Heaven or Hell, Christian Haunted House, etc.) Strider 25 6773 December 3, 2014 at 3:07 pm
Last Post: abaris
  Do Christians really believe most of us are going to hell? GrandizerII 126 18500 July 15, 2014 at 11:52 am
Last Post: Wyrd of Gawd



Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)