Atheism +

[Autumnlicious]

It's so fucking arbitrary. Each person has their own individual set of expectations. Idiots.

Second you criticize them for having arbitrary beliefs, they move goal posts to "We're creating a safe space".

Apparently, safe space is characterized by the same characteristics as an echo chamber.

[thesummerqueen]

Of course the labels are arbitrary.

I call myself a photographer because it's what I love to do. My boyfriend, on the other hand, does it for a living. Who's more right?

I call myself a cook, but I've never worked in a restaurant. I call myself a foodie, but I don't hang with other foodies and foodie things - I just have a sincere and deep appreciation of food and cooking, from the seeking of the ingredients to the science of the recipe to the pleasure of consumption. I call myself a skeptic, but don't attend the functions. I call myself by these labels because they're all true - but it's unfortunately up to you to make sure we're not having a failure to communicate as to what they mean.

These women, unfortunately, are skeptical of everything but themselves. They haven't hijacked a term, and I think it's abundantly clear that not everyone in the skeptic or atheist communities (which overlap but are not synonymous) agrees with them or holds the same values.

I do agree, it's silly as hell. There was actually a woman at TAM who got blasted by one of the skepchicks for wearing a shirt that said "I am a Skeptic. Not a Skepchick. Not a female Skeptic. A Skeptic." to denote that she wasn't part of some marginalizing group of people. Skepticism as a way of approaching the world shouldn't have anything to do with your sexuality or gender.

On the other hand, if you feel it's important to have an all-girls clubhouse because it makes you feel more comfortable, go do it. That's what makes this country great. Just stop shitting on everyone else for not holding your view.

[TaraJo]

Second you criticize them for having arbitrary beliefs, they move goal posts to "We're creating a safe space".

Apparently, safe space is characterized by the same characteristics as an echo chamber.

I know. And intellectual, skeptical thought is difficult, if not impossible, if your ideas can't be questioned.

As long as its in good faith, I want my beliefs to be questioned; if I'm wrong, I want to know I'm wrong so I can abandon incorrect beliefs or at least fine tune otherwise solid beliefs that have singular flaws.

[Faith No More]

I'm still confused as to what Atheism+ acutally entails. After skimming a small part of their website, the appear on the surface to be atheists for social equality, inlcuding homosexual and gender issues, but from the statements I've read online by the members of Atheism+ makes it sounds like it's radical feminism coupled with atheism

What the hell is going on here? What do these people truly stand for?

[thesummerqueen]

They don't think "regular" atheists are pushing social justice enough - and by social justice, I mean feminist issues.

[Tiberius]

radical feminism coupled with atheism

You answered your own question.

[Shell B]

Of course the labels are arbitrary.

Not the labels, sweetie. The rules for those silly cards.

I call myself a photographer because it's what I love to do. My boyfriend, on the other hand, does it for a living. Who's more right?

Neither of you is exactly wrong, but if one were speaking for clarity's sake, he is more right. When one says they are something, that suggests that they do it for a living. Saying you like something shows that it is a hobby. I mean, you know that if you told someone you were a photographer, they would assume you meant a professional one.

I call myself a cook, but I've never worked in a restaurant.

While this is markedly different than what I am talking about, I still don't get the point. Sorry. You're not a cook. Nonetheless, that is not comparable to the skeptic thing. A skeptic has a definition already that has absolutely nothing to do with profession. The capital S skeptics have nothing to do with professions or hobbies, either. I just fail to see the parallel you're trying to make.

Still, I get what you mean about people labeling themselves certain things, but I think redefining things convolutes communication that is already muddled by strategic redefining done by skeptics, atheists and theists alike. Let's keep our words clear and easily defined so that conversations cannot get sidetracked on issues of semantics.

I call myself a foodie, but I don't hang with other foodies and foodie things - I just have a sincere and deep appreciation of food and cooking, from the seeking of the ingredients to the science of the recipe to the pleasure of consumption.

That's what a foodie is, Summer. A foodie is someone who is interested in food more than the act of eating it. You don't have to hang out with foodies to be a foodie.

I call myself by these labels because they're all true

But, they're not. Almost everyone cooks. Not even close to everyone is a cook. Almost everyone takes pictures. Not even close to everyone is a photographer or even a fairly decent hobby photographer.

unfortunately up to you to make sure we're not having a failure to communicate as to what they mean.

Or, these people could let us stick to dictionaries and stop pretending to speak for everyone. The stuff you mentioned above, for the most part, isn't really a problem. You can call yourself a cook without people assuming your actions reflect that of all cooks. You can do the same whilst calling yourself a photographer, etc. The thing about certain skeptic and atheist groups are that they are failing to differentiate themselves from the rest of us. The onus is on them to do that. I wouldn't join a softball league and then create a separate team, play for both and call the second team the same as the first.

They haven't hijacked a term, and I think it's abundantly clear that not everyone in the skeptic or atheist communities (which overlap but are not synonymous) agrees with them or holds the same values.

It's clear to you. It's clear to me. It's not clear to Johnny the average Christian. Actually, to be fair, it's not even clear to Johnny your average atheist. The majority of atheists I meet outside of here think atheism is some kind of movement and are pulling no true atheists arguments like it is nobody's business.

On the other hand, if you feel it's important to have an all-girls clubhouse because it makes you feel more comfortable, go do it. That's what makes this country great. Just stop shitting on everyone else for not holding your view.

Yeah, I don't really give a fuck what they do. I just wish they wouldn't hijack a perfectly good word.

[Puddleglum]

Couldn't someone at least pretend to be an A+ fan so I can amuse myself by mocking you?

[Shell B]

Go to their facebook page.

[TaraJo]

So, I'm kinda witnessing the atheism+ circle jerk come up again. I have a bunch of atheist or science channels on my youtube subscriptions and one of them posted a video about atheism+

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebJxSl38oGs

And when these videos come up, I like to get an idea how the atheist community as a whole responds to them. It honestly sounded like some sincere criticisms and legitimate concerns of atheism+ and it was put forth in such a way that nobody should have been insulted or hurt. The good news is that most of the people commenting agree, but there are some people who keep commenting about how angry they are over it. Plus, PZMeyers himself watched it..... sort of. He watched the beginning and immediately dismissed the rest and he's spent this morning bashing the video on twitter.

https://twitter.com/pzmyers

I don't want to say atheism+ is a religion, but it has many of the same traits that I find most repulsive about religion.