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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 13, 2013 at 7:16 pm
(This post was last modified: June 13, 2013 at 7:23 pm by ManMachine.)
"The greatest deception men suffer is from their own opinions" - Leonardo da Vinci
"I think I use the term “radical” rather loosely, just for emphasis. If you describe yourself as “atheist,” some people will say, “Don’t you mean ‘agnostic’?” I have to reply that I really do mean atheist, I really do not believe that there is a god; in fact, I am convinced that there is not a god (a subtle difference). I see not a shred of evidence to suggest that there is one ... etc., etc. It’s easier to say that I am a radical atheist, just to signal that I really mean it, have thought about it a great deal, and that it’s an opinion I hold seriously." - Douglas Adams (and I echo the sentiment)
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 13, 2013 at 7:54 pm
(June 13, 2013 at 4:19 pm)NoraBrimstone Wrote: This thread has totally convinced me that I will force my kids not to eat meat, even when they are old enough to decide for themselves. I'm unsure how I should punish them if they disobey me. What do you fine people suggest?
Indoctrination of children is just a euphemism for teaching things someone else doesn't like.
If you teach them how to squish down a hamburger to fit it in their mouths, to a hippie, youi're indoctrinating them into a lifestyle of animal torture.
If you teach them to recycle or to conserve energy, or that non-humans should be protected, to a Texan, you're indoctrinating them into the God-hating world of tree-hugger terrorists.
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Re: Childhood indoctrination
June 13, 2013 at 7:54 pm
Yeah, no.
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 13, 2013 at 11:12 pm
(This post was last modified: June 13, 2013 at 11:13 pm by Rahul.)
(June 13, 2013 at 7:54 pm)bennyboy Wrote: If you teach them to recycle or to conserve energy, or that non-humans should be protected, to a Texan, you're indoctrinating them into the God-hating world of tree-hugger terrorists.
WTF?
Why you gotta single us out, hippie!?!?!
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 13, 2013 at 11:51 pm
(June 13, 2013 at 11:12 pm)Rahul Wrote: (June 13, 2013 at 7:54 pm)bennyboy Wrote: If you teach them to recycle or to conserve energy, or that non-humans should be protected, to a Texan, you're indoctrinating them into the God-hating world of tree-hugger terrorists.
WTF?
Why you gotta single us out, hippie!?!?!
Just a little creative indoctrination, is all. 
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 15, 2013 at 4:22 am
(June 13, 2013 at 4:19 pm)NoraBrimstone Wrote: This thread has totally convinced me that I will force my kids not to eat meat, even when they are old enough to decide for themselves. I'm unsure how I should punish them if they disobey me. What do you fine people suggest? You can't force anyone, least of all your own children. From everything I hear once they reach a certain age they'll do whatever they want and particularly the things that piss you off just for the sake of pissing you off  Ah, the joy of parenthood 
For me this discussion isn't about forcing anyone to do/not-do something, although the opposition keeps putting that strawman up. I just won't let an argument in favor of animal products stand unchallenged, I feel I owe that to the animals. What everyone here does or doesn't do is only up to them.
"Men see clearly enough the barbarity of all ages — except their own!" — Ernest Crosby.
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Re: Childhood indoctrination
June 15, 2013 at 5:40 am
But... the thread title..
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 15, 2013 at 8:39 am
(June 15, 2013 at 5:40 am)NoraBrimstone Wrote: But... the thread title.. Indoctrination is not forcing someone. It's guiding them, without them knowing there is another possibility. 
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 16, 2013 at 5:54 pm
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RE: Childhood indoctrination
June 16, 2013 at 6:14 pm
(June 3, 2013 at 4:30 am)Gilgamesh Wrote: I can't justify exploiting them for entertainment (like zoo's.) If letting living things live happy is preferable, and we can entertain ourselves without locking animals up, then there's no reason to exploit them that way. I also can't justify killing them for clothing. If preserving life is preferable, and we can create clothes from things not alive, then there's no reason to kill them for clothes.
But people like eating them, myself included, so killing them for food is justified. We can nourish ourselves with plants and not animals, but I'd rather not, because my desire to eat meat is stronger than my desire to have animals live.
Morality is subjective. Any given moral of any given person is derived from what that person thinks is ideal/important, and everyone has a different idea of what is ideal/important.
Yes this pretty much sums up my position. Also, animals being used for scientific research gets a big plus from me. I'd be dead without it.
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