Education in America

[Slave]

@popeyespappy: No doubt about it, having a family that supports and encourages children to excell in school helps attainment levels and improves test results. But that isn't the end of the discussion. It stands to reason that kids who live in poverty fare worse in school than kids in better financial standing. It comes down to parental involvement and prospects. A poor kid living in America, most likely comes from a single parent household, where their mother/father works long hours to support them. Parents play a pivotal role in the education of children and more important still are mentors for teenagers. Impoverished areas also deal with higher crime rates, and kids from these areas may be tempted to slack off from school and sell drugs instead, because what chance do they have in getting a good education when they can't afford college? All common sense stuff really. But the problem goes deeper than that.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/educat...56266.html
http://www.forbes.com/sites/billflax/201...your-kids/

You do raise an interesting point though. I have been investigating into the problems with education for a little over a year now, and what I have found is that schools tend to be limiting and homeschooling or schools with a more unstructured approach produce better students and just generally happier people.

[Minimalist]

The root of the problem is the entire industry we've built upon the current school system and how the system conflicts with the way that children and adults alike naturally learn.

Oddly, though, people had no trouble learning before under such a system.

I agree with the OP. The problem is cultural and not biological. Far too many kids expect a teacher to be an entertainer, and why not. We have built an entire culture on being entertained 24/7 365.

Anyone who has not done so should go watch the 1976 film "Network." Unlike the fucking bible you will see a prophecy that came true.

[Anomalocaris]

The problem with American education is that it expects the citizens to be well-rounded, and unfortunately not everyone is going to be great in every subject no matter how much they study. Another problem is that colleges, merely to make as much money as possible, expect their students to take courses which are not even geared toward the careers for which the students are striving.

Well rounded doesn't mean good at everything. Well rounded means have enough grounding across the breadth of systematic human knowledge so that one would not end up being a drone that is skill in one field, but hopeless foolish when pipping up about societal problems that inevitably spans much of the field of basic human knowledge.

[popeyespappy]

Oddly, though, people had no trouble learning before under such a system.

This.

If you want to see a prime example of a structured school system carry your ass to South Korea or Japan and check out their primary schools. The children there don't seem to have a lot of trouble learning in a structured environment.

As far as home schooling goes the families that would have the most difficultly home schooling their children are the same families who's children do poorly in the public school system. How is that going to help?

[Anomalocaris]

Oddly, though, people had no trouble learning before under such a system.

This.

If you want to see a prime example of a structured school system carry your ass to South Korea or Japan and check out their primary schools. The children there don't seem to have a lot of trouble learning in a structured environment.

As far as home schooling goes the families that would have the most difficultly home schooling their children are the same families who's children do poorly in the public school system. How is that going to help?

This is because we think of primary schools not as academies, but as part of bread and circus.

[popeyespappy]

I don't get the bread and circus reference.

[Anomalocaris]

I don't get the bread and circus reference.

Bread and circus is what Roman Emperors gives to citizens in the city of Rome so they would feel enfranchized, without in any practical way actually empowered, or made productive.

[pineapplebunnybounce]

Oddly, though, people had no trouble learning before under such a system.

This.

If you want to see a prime example of a structured school system carry your ass to South Korea or Japan and check out their primary schools. The children there don't seem to have a lot of trouble learning in a structured environment.

As far as home schooling goes the families that would have the most difficultly home schooling their children are the same families who's children do poorly in the public school system. How is that going to help?

Exactly. School isn't about fun. Believe it or not. School is about learning how to function in a world that requires structure and productivity. I'm not in favour of home schooling, kids are too sheltered, I feel. There's a danger in being over-protective, schools aren't perfect, but the world isn't either. In school you deal with friends, bullies, funny people, mean people, friendly people, different people. You even have crappy teachers who resemble your future crappy bosses. School is a lot more than just gaining knowledge, it's about understanding how life works.

School is about responsibility. It's not meant to take over your life, you can have fun outside of school. But it's a responsibility, and kids need to understand that, it's an important part of growing up.

I grew up in asian school system, between ages 7 to 12 I spent 3 hours on homework per school day. It was the best time of my life, the friends I made then are still my best friends today, I learned to stand up to people (including teachers, which got me into trouble), I learned to do my work even when I'm upset, I learned what is expected of me as a person. During exam seasons we would get as many as 3 exams in a single day, and even as a kid I would pull all-nighters to prepare for exams and projects, I remember many nights where I would be the only one awake and studying. To this day I can pull all-nighters like nobody's business, while my friends go to bed and do a sloppy job on their assignments. I have never considered sacrificing my assignment for sleep, however minor it is. The subjects I hated and thought was useless, I did it anyway, because I understood if I did not I wouldn't get into the school of my choice. Did they turn out to be useless? In terms of content, yes. But they got me into the school I wanted, and that's all that mattered to me. The subjects I liked I would pursue on my own free time. These are valuable lessons in life, I wouldn't trade those years for anything else. And I continued on in an asian school system until I was 16.

I mean, should we talk about what is useless to teach and what isn't? Sure. But there's also a danger in allowing kids to pick what they don't want to learn too soon. I know friends who opted out of the chinese language classes when we were kids simply because they weren't good at it and their parents couldn't help them with it, and they hated it. Now they regret it but it'll take them so much longer to master the language, and time is so much harder to come by in your 20s.

[Silver]

I'm 26 and I sleep with my phone in my bed with me, right by my face. I thought most people did?

I thought the only people who did that were corporate slaves, not wanting to miss a call to go into work.

[Minimalist]

George Carlin nailed it almost 10 years ago.