This is why I hate people who hate "fucking christians"

[Jacob(smooth)]

Oh I share the distaste of those behaviors. Probably more so than you since I also experience embarrassment by association.

So in effect you are saying that even though all christians worship the same christ, read the same bible, talk to the same god in prayer, and are influenced and directed by the same holy spirit, that the direct infusion of the holy spirit is not strong enough to nudge them into being better, more consistent people. Not even enough to be indicated by statistics.
How pathetic.

That's exactly what I'm saying, yes. Whether you take the Christian view on what Christianity is OR the atheist view the idea that any belief would make people the same is absurd.

[Brakeman]

So in effect you are saying that even though all christians worship the same christ, read the same bible, talk to the same god in prayer, and are influenced and directed by the same holy spirit, that the direct infusion of the holy spirit is not strong enough to nudge them into being better, more consistent people. Not even enough to be indicated by statistics.
How pathetic.

That's exactly what I'm saying, yes. Whether you take the Christian view on what Christianity is OR the atheist view the idea that any belief would make people the same is absurd.

So can you explain the incredibly weak or non-existent influence that this infusion of the holy spirit has on people, despite the perfect knowledge and power of god? Can you explain how god can "inspire" some christians so perfectly that they can purport to write the scriptures in his stead, but be unable to tell other christians that their interpretations and understandings of his will are incorrect during their prayer conversations?

[Simon Moon]

And, apparently, their are also atheists who are willing to state that they "hate xtians". Apparently collectively and indiscriminately. Lumping them all together and apparently experiencing strong negative emotional feelings towards them because they believe something you don't.

I do not hate Christians. I despise their beliefs. I have family and friends that are Christians. I don't hate them, I love them.


The problem is that people's beliefs inform their actions.

The fact that you do not act like a dick, does not excuse all the Christians that do.

You are ALL reading and interpreting the same book in order to justify your behaviors and actions.

The fact that you seem like you are probably a progressive type of Christian, is meaningless. Those Christians that act like the Westboro Baptist church get their justification from the same book as you do.

When atheists act like dicks, it is because they are dicks. And they would be dicks no matter if they were atheists or not. Acting like dicks does not make them bad atheists, it makes them bad humans.

[Brakeman]

That's exactly what I'm saying, yes. Whether you take the Christian view on what Christianity is OR the atheist view the idea that any belief would make people the same is absurd.

The bible would be a very different book if christianity and judaism were simply about belief without an actual effect by god.
No miracles, no smiting, no sun standing still, just a lot of talk about people that believed something that they can't observe. How exciting.

You can't be a True Christian ™ and believe anything like that..

[Jacob(smooth)]

And, apparently, their are also atheists who are willing to state that they "hate xtians". Apparently collectively and indiscriminately. Lumping them all together and apparently experiencing strong negative emotional feelings towards them because they believe something you don't.

I do not hate Christians. I despise their beliefs. I have family and friends that are Christians. I don't hate them, I love them.


The problem is that people's beliefs inform their actions.

The fact that you do not act like a dick, does not excuse all the Christians that do.

You are ALL reading and interpreting the same book in order to justify your behaviors and actions.

The fact that you seem like you are probably a progressive type of Christian, is meaningless. Those Christians that act like the Westboro Baptist church get their justification from the same book as you do.

When atheists act like dicks, it is because they are dicks. And they would be dicks no matter if they were atheists or not. Acting like dicks does not make them bad atheists, it makes them bad humans.

Nothing at all I disagree with there. And I would not want to excuse Christians who act like dicks!

[Minimalist]

Min, I think the world of you and all, but you can't seriously be unaware of the charitable work done the world over by churches

You know, Brian, I do still recall attending church when I was a kid and it seemed to me that every fucking mass the bastards were taking up a special collection for some shit or other.

The "missions." The "retirement fund for priests and nuns. The "new roof." The "new cesspool." The "victims" of whatever recent storm. Oh, and yeah...there was a "poor box" at the back of the church but they never gave that a plug.

My point is not how efficient they are at extorting money from the idiots who sit in the pews. I was wondering when the fuckers were going to dip into their OWN pocket and help those people. I have no doubt that they are collecting money left and right. I bet some of it even reaches the Philippines....where I imagine it will be used to rebuild the fucking churches.

[*Deidre*]

It is easy to nearly create a "religion" out of becoming anti-religion. Atheists by and large, should seek to avoid that, but 'tis a slippery slope, indeed.

[Brakeman]

It is easy to nearly create a "religion" out of becoming anti-religion. Atheists by and large, should seek to avoid that, but 'tis a slippery slope, indeed.

How do you propose that we could "slip" and fall into a religion as atheists?

from Google:
re·li·gion
riˈlijən/
noun
noun: religion

1.
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, esp. a personal God or gods.
"ideas about the relationship between science and religion"
synonyms: faith, belief, worship, creed

Doesn't really seem like something we might do to me..

What are you trying to say?

[*Deidre*]

It is easy to nearly create a "religion" out of becoming anti-religion. Atheists by and large, should seek to avoid that, but 'tis a slippery slope, indeed.

How do you propose that we could "slip" and fall into a religion as atheists?

from Google:
re·li·gion
riˈlijən/
noun
noun: religion

1.
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, esp. a personal God or gods.
"ideas about the relationship between science and religion"
synonyms: faith, belief, worship, creed

Doesn't really seem like something we might do to me..

What are you trying to say?

Metaphorically speaking, which is why I placed ''religion'' in quotes.

One could make it a mission almost, to spend one's time fighting against religion, and that in and of itself, becomes a belief system for that individual.

It's important to stand up for what is right, and not let religous factions take over public square, but it's another to focus one's attention on dismantling religion. It's here to stay. It's better to find ways to educate people as to what atheism is than to spend one's time discrediting religion.

That is more of my point.

And quite frankly, religious people do a smashing job of discrediting themselves. lol Atheists and agnostics don't need to get in the fray.

[Bob Kelso]

I'll be perfectly honest, I fucking hate most Christians in my area, but for actual reasons. They proselytize like mad, they slap Christian teachers on the back for "witnessing" to kids against he law and get away with it, they treat the atheists of the community like shit when they find out they don't believe and generally don't act any different from the rest of society but look down on the rest of us from their pious pedestals.

Now there are exceptions to the rule, like my wonderful loving girlfriend who never offers to pitch her faith at me, we talk about it in calm tones and respect each other's belief. She knows I'm atheist/anti-theist and she's fine with it, I don't particularly like the fact she's a deist (she believes there is a higher power but isn't sure if it's any of the abrahamic gods) she's so wonderful it doesn't matter to me.