Vaccines are a plot by big pharma!

[My imaginary friend is GOD]

Come on you surly don't believe that crap, I can admit that there could be some use in vac., but you hold dearly to what you believe and nothing will shift that lol.

A sufficient amount of evidence to the contrary would. But in fact, there is NO evidence to the contrary.

[thesummerqueen]

No - all early iterations in the beginning of learning how to vaccinate people were shady. Much like learning how to make medication.

I think vaccinations made now, with proper testing in laboratory conditions, are perfectly safe for all but specific individuals. Like, they ask me if I have an egg allergy before they stick me, and if I had said yes they would have used a different sort. Proper medical procedures are like that.

I don't believe they cause cancer.

I don't believe they caused your problems either - but I'm willing to change my mind if you can come up with a doctor's note.

I don't believe they cause autism. I've already said why.

[The Valkyrie]

Hey, I go to bed and you have your argument without me .

Go if you must. But if you can manage just one answer for me I'd be very grateful. It's very simple, a yes or no answer to help me understand your position. It is professionally relevant to me so it helps me to understand where people who hold your views are coming from.

Do you believe that the polio vaccine prevents people from getting polio?

Well it can look as if it does prevent polio, but as I said, polio was fading out at the time the vac. came out.

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One hundred percent of people who get vaccinated will die. Therefore, vaccines cause death. Therefore, the fact that there are more vaccines means that people are dying overlapping deaths.

Vaccines cause double, sometimes triple deaths. By your logic, this is also true.

You fool, does everyone die from smoking related disease, so of course everyone isn't going to die from vac., but there will be many who will.

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Just a question, has there been medications that have killed many people, and then withdrawn?.

No, polio is actually coming back into regions where either religious or anti-medicine sentiments are preventing the vaccinations to be given. As a result it is spreading once again through parts of Africa and Asia.

I suppose the smallpox vaccine had nothing to do with eradicating smallpox?

[TaraJo]

"Medication" is not synonymous with "vaccine" - a few medications have been known to kill people, and then they've been taken off the market. Vaccines have not been known to kill people, so they are still in use.

Come on you surly don't believe that crap, I can admit that there could be some use in vac., but you hold dearly to what you believe and nothing will shift that lol.

It's not just what she believes, it's what the peer reviewed science has evidenced. When the evidence tells us otherwise, we'll believe otherwise. That's kinda how science and skepticism work. So far, Andrew Wakefield had the closest thing to science that proved harm from vaccines and his findings were so flawed that his license to practice medicine was revoked. That's not exactly someone I would call an especially credible source.

[thesummerqueen]

Actually, he didn't. The study wasn't just flawed, it was pretty much malpractice and could have been considered child abuse. He didn't "find" anything - he set out to "prove" something and didn't give a fuck who he hurt in the process. It involved 11 case subjects - definitely not enough - and has since been taken down and retracted so thoroughly that it would boggle my mind that it's still touted if it weren't for the fact that some people still believe in god.

[TaraJo]

Actually, he didn't. The study wasn't just flawed, it was pretty much malpractice and could have been considered child abuse. He didn't "find" anything - he set out to "prove" something and didn't give a fuck who he hurt in the process. It involved 11 case subjects - definitely not enough - and has since been taken down and retracted so thoroughly that it would boggle my mind that it's still touted if it weren't for the fact that some people still believe in god.

Very true. But it's still the closest we've had to legitimate science saying vaccines are bad. And if the best you can do when attacking vaccines involves malpractice, child abuse and fraud, you really don't have a good leg to stand on.

[thesummerqueen]

But it's still the closest we've had to legitimate science saying vaccines are bad.

I'm drawing the line at even saying that, mostly because he was doing it only so he could advertise his own vaccine. When you deliberately set out to commit fraud, it no longer even resembles legit science.

[TaraJo]

But it's still the closest we've had to legitimate science saying vaccines are bad.

I'm drawing the line at even saying that, mostly because he was doing it only so he could advertise his own vaccine. When you deliberately set out to commit fraud, it no longer even resembles legit science.

Yeah. Truth be told, he's a con man who was attempting to use pseudo science to push his product. Which is honestly something that needs to be watched out for; when you actually learn a thing or two about real science, it amazes you just how much garbage science there is out there to trick people into buying stuff they don't need.

[psychoslice]

OK, I can see that everyone here doesn't agree with my way of thinking, and I don't agree with yours, this discussion is getting out of hand, and we are all getting too personal, I don't like making enemies.
So I'll leave this thread now, as I have said i have schzophrenia, and because of this I am becoming parodoid, as you also said I am not educated, yes I never did good at school, but I do have the sense to know what is right for me, I have said things to you that I am not proud of and I am sorry for that, yes you did get to me and I am hurt, so I will leave now, thank you.

[Jackalope]

Let's put this into perspective, shall we?

The pandemic of 1918 killed an estimated 20-100 million people.

Influenza vaccines were developed between that pandemic and the next.

The Asian flu pandemic of 1957-1958 killed between 1 and 1.5 million people.

The Hong Kong flu pandemic of 1968-1968 killed approximately 1 million people.

The death toll from the Russian flu pandemic of 1977-1978 is not known.

The 2009 H1N1 flu pandemic killed approximately 280,000 people.

How many people are claimed to have been killed by vaccines? How many claimed experienced serious side-effects?

By all means, don't get vaccinated. Do your part to take us back to 1918 and the horrifying death tolls from a largely preventable disease.