God is timeless

[Whateverist]

I'm not saying you'd argue subjective superiority. I'm just pointing out that you have no other option than to understand me by way of your understanding of everything. Same goes for me. I also am not claiming superiority, just personal preference. And I really don't begrudge you yours.

when I said this, I was saying this to show I agree with what you said before, not to raise contention. as you said:

Even if I'm right, I wouldn't begrudge you your experience with your consciousness the way you have it.

and I agree with this entirely.

Well good on us both. Funny how much more there is to talk about when we disagree than when we agree, isn't it? Shall we further test our common ground?

What about an afterlife?

I'm not against it mind you. But I feel much more certain that that isn't in the cards than I do that gods (in some shape or form) don't exist. I suspect all the eternity we'll ever know is the kind that comes in 'timeless nows'. Eternity doesn't have to be measured as an extent of time I don't think. And even if some gods were eternal in the expanse-of-time sense, it wouldn't mean we can or will be joining them in that.

Do you have any settled opinion about that?

[daandaan]

StrongWaters is probably an atheist and he's geting a good heartly laugh out of you guys. Probably someone's sockpuppet...

PS: None of this has anything to do with "God's timelessness."

If you are to understand Time by the Hebrew perspective, you need two things. First, you need the language itself. Second, you need tradition from the culture. One is not far from the other since the whole of Hebrew linguistics is the roots of the tree of knowledge. I'll do my best to fill you in on the basic understanding you need. See my last post to see this from a western perspective.

By the western perspective, time related verbs all relate to past, present and future tenses. Our words reflect this mindset. To the Hebrew, verbs are actions only. Actions are either completed, being accomplished or future accomplishment. You might see this as the same thing, but this is not the eternal view of the Hebrew words. Eternity is already a reality, while the emanation of creation (En Sof) is better compared to a movie or DVD playing from beginning to end with the characters as performers in the production. The Matrix metaphor is a good version of this.

When you transliterate Hebrew letters into measurements, time is the Aleph (Alpha), or the egg, and Tav is Time. Tav is the omega, or last letter. Compare this to Christ saying this in Revelation 1.

8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Compare this to Isaiah 40: “I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come. I say, ‘My purpose will stand, and I will do all that I please.’”

In relation to the father/egg, we see DNA inside the outer wall of the enclosure, which is what an emendation is. A true view of eternity by God's perspective is to see how the emanation is expressed by the Hebrew mindset.

From here, I'll refer to this key:



Lexicon (Benner) Root 1007 is TIME (Zan / Aleph) - "The letter Zan represents an agricultural implement of cutting used in the harvest. The harvest is a very prominent "time" to the early Hebrews. Aleph is the strong ox. This word can be a point in time or a specific time.

Don't miss the pictograph meaning. You should get this if you know how time is cut. What you may not get is the harvest in relation. What is harvested may surprise you. The Zan is like the grim reaper's blade. It is used as the Strength (Aleph) to Cut / Divide (Zan). A grain is an Ear, or the part of the seed that opens to allow expression of information. The harvest is a process to plant a seed, watch it grow, then cut it at the stalk. It is then beaten in the threshing floor and tossed to free the wheat form the chaff (body). What is being harvested? Information from the grain. Word.

John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it

What is cut in this verse above? Light from darkness.

Looking at the past, we get the word Ancient, or Before. It is the following pictographs. Mem, Dal, Quph. The idea is eternity, a door and the water. Mem is ultimately Hydrogen, or the waters of the deep. Cutting the waters is the nuclear force and energy associated with the chain reactions of the strong nuclear force over the weak. In other words, the strength to cut, divide and make something new. Elements originate from Hydrogen, which consist of one proton (+) and one electron (-) in balance. In the early universe, this is a high state of order with low entropy. Time happens when the unity is divide into multiplicity.

All other elements that follow have the Neutron as the strong house (Aleph Bet) of the force exerted on charged particles. The Strong House, or Strong Force is what contains the strong nuclear force and heels the electron by invariant symmetry laws.

There are many more words that can be used, but one of the main points to know is that what is past if before you. Before means what comes before for us. For the Hebrew mindset, it is what you are facing. You face the past because you see it. The future is unknown. To God, the future is an eternal reality. It is already divided and cut by His strength. In other words, Aleph Tav knows from beginning to end. He makes the end known from the beginning. In other words, it's a circle.

Now, move on from this to the idea of the Ruach Elohim, or Spirit of God. Once you know this, you cannot unknow.

Here is a word study I did on the Spirit of God. It relates to the cycles of time and how the Father (Aleph Bet) Creates the Son (House of Seed) as the cosmic egg of the new beginnings. Cycles must repeat to be eternal.

Before we begin this word study, consider this: the Father (Alephbet - Letters) points us to the Word, then shines a light. Darkness is divided. The Word then points us back to the Father (letters) of creation. What is the light revealing? The meaning of the letters and words.

In Galatians 1-3, Paul makes it clear that the promise of the Gospel is gaining the Spirit. Our goal is to return to the origin of Life, which is the Spirit of God (Ruach Elohim). In Genesis 1, the first creation of paradise is by Elohim. In Genesis 2, we have the Lord creating the material world and giving mankind coats of animal skin (Beast / Genesis 3). What is our goal here in the material world? Overcoming the beast (animal nature). When we do, we are born not of water, but of Spirit. First, we must be born of both water and Spirit (John 3). Gaining union with the Spirit here in the refinery (Deuteronomy 4) gives birth to our new nature above (John 3).

Once you know from this word study, you cannot unknow. Do you want me to post the word study on how the Spirit cycles in a repeated path? It's really the best part of this story.

nice try ..all complete bullshit becouse our languages r all decended from sanskrit ..

and ``in the beginning ``..just means that god had to start somewhere...meaning he isnt timeless..


8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”

so god is a flat circle , not a Multi dimesional beeing as u claim ...

[Rational AKD]

Well good on us both. Funny how much more there is to talk about when we disagree than when we agree, isn't it? Shall we further test our common ground?

What about an afterlife?

I'm not against it mind you. But I feel much more certain that that isn't in the cards than I do that gods (in some shape or form) don't exist. I suspect all the eternity we'll ever know is the kind that comes in 'timeless nows'. Eternity doesn't have to be measured as an extent of time I don't think. And even if some gods were eternal in the expanse-of-time sense, it wouldn't mean we can or will be joining them in that.

Do you have any settled opinion about that?

my views on afterlife are very Christian (as I myself am Christian). the only thing that's a little more unusual concerning my belief in afterlife is my view on hell. I do not believe hell is literal fire and brimstone, but actually more of a place of self torment due to shame.

as far as eternity goes in respect to God, I think in the beginning was timeless, or without time and when he created time became an active part of time. so that would make him without beginning but not infinitely old in the past since the past itself is limited. but it would also make the number of years ahead of him infinitely great, which is what I also believe of the afterlife.

[FreeTony]

I do not believe hell is literal fire and brimstone, but actually more of a place of self torment due to shame.

Sorry to jump in and take this off topic, but why would someone feel shame in hell?

[daandaan]

Well good on us both. Funny how much more there is to talk about when we disagree than when we agree, isn't it? Shall we further test our common ground?

What about an afterlife?

I'm not against it mind you. But I feel much more certain that that isn't in the cards than I do that gods (in some shape or form) don't exist. I suspect all the eternity we'll ever know is the kind that comes in 'timeless nows'. Eternity doesn't have to be measured as an extent of time I don't think. And even if some gods were eternal in the expanse-of-time sense, it wouldn't mean we can or will be joining them in that.

Do you have any settled opinion about that?

my views on afterlife are very Christian (as I myself am Christian). the only thing that's a little more unusual concerning my belief in afterlife is my view on hell. I do not believe hell is literal fire and brimstone, but actually more of a place of self torment due to shame.

as far as eternity goes in respect to God, I think in the beginning was timeless, or without time and when he created time became an active part of time. so that would make him without beginning but not infinitely old in the past since the past itself is limited. but it would also make the number of years ahead of him infinitely great, which is what I also believe of the afterlife.

so u r inventing ur own religion???

its not what ur buybull says..

[Rational AKD]

Sorry to jump in and take this off topic, but why would someone feel shame in hell?

for their shame of their sins. in hell they would think of what they have done wrong, which would cause them to feel shameful of it. here in this world, we are able to forget, but not there.

so u r inventing ur own religion???

its not what ur buybull says..

no... i'm not. i'm taking a different interpretation than mainstream Christians claiming their interpretation is not what was originally meant. if you want to know why, watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-q5vGcpx1sY

[FreeTony]

for their shame of their sins. in hell they would think of what they have done wrong, which would cause them to feel shameful of it. here in this world, we are able to forget, but not there.

So someone who kills someone, but believes in Jesus, will go to heaven and there they don't feel any shame about their prior actions?

[daandaan]

Sorry to jump in and take this off topic, but why would someone feel shame in hell?

for their shame of their sins. in hell they would think of what they have done wrong, which would cause them to feel shameful of it. here in this world, we are able to forget, but not there.

so u r inventing ur own religion???

its not what ur buybull says..

no... i'm not. i'm taking a different interpretation than mainstream Christians claiming their interpretation is not what was originally meant. if you want to know why, watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-q5vGcpx1sY

why is ur god so powerless to make it clear to u all how it happened according to his truth ??

[Neo-Scholastic]

for their shame of their sins. in hell they would think of what they have done wrong, which would cause them to feel shameful of it. here in this world, we are able to forget, but not there.

So someone who kills someone, but believes in Jesus, will go to heaven and there they don't feel any shame about their prior actions?

If they believe if Jesus they wouldn't kill someone.

[FreeTony]

If they believe if Jesus they wouldn't kill someone.

1. They could murder someone, then believe in Jesus later
2. Then can and do. So many examples I could give, e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Roede...er_suspect

Cue No True Scotsman...