Child Sacrifice in the Old Testament

[Esquilax]

I like how you dodged the question by responding with ad hominem attacks, assuming I lack an understanding of the Bible, despite the fact that you have no rebuttal of the actual texts.

Hoo boy, you'd better get used to that, if you're going to continue this argument.

[Sinnersburninhell100]

Oh, so only the firstborn Hebrews were to be circumcised? That's a new one. And if you read the rebukes in Jeremiah relating to child sacrifice, it makes clear that the Israelites were guilty of slaughtering their sons and daughters...to Baal. That seems to be the real crime. It also makes sense of the myth of Abraham and Issac, which was a later Hebrew tradition intended to portray the abolishment of child sacrifice.

---

And let's not forget the climax and crux of the Christian narrative, God literally offering his son as a blood sacrifice--as the author of Hebrews notes--"In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness" (Hebrews 9:22).

It's new because you do not know what's written within the pages of the Bible. Yes, they sacrificed to a false god an idol of wood and stone, not to the God of creation, go study the Bible before you spit out nonsense. Yes it was a real crime to God, if you had known what was in the book of Jeremiah you would have understood this. They are severely punished because of this act, go read the rest of the OT and you might find out, that is if you can be honest with yourself.
Christ is part of the Godhead and chose to give Himself up in this way for mankind, yes He was God's son, not your's, mine or anyone else, God only asked this of Himself. So what's your point? Now go and find out why blood is the requirement, hint it starts in the OT. You're wanting to prove me wrong do your own work, please.

GC

Go! Get 'em Godschild!!!

[Godscreated]

It's new because you do not know what's written within the pages of the Bible. Yes, they sacrificed to a false god an idol of wood and stone, not to the God of creation, go study the Bible before you spit out nonsense. Yes it was a real crime to God, if you had known what was in the book of Jeremiah you would have understood this. They are severely punished because of this act, go read the rest of the OT and you might find out, that is if you can be honest with yourself.
Christ is part of the Godhead and chose to give Himself up in this way for mankind, yes He was God's son, not your's, mine or anyone else, God only asked this of Himself. So what's your point? Now go and find out why blood is the requirement, hint it starts in the OT. You're wanting to prove me wrong do your own work, please.

GC

I like how you dodged the question by responding with ad hominem attacks, assuming I lack an understanding of the Bible, despite the fact that you have no rebuttal of the actual texts. Even Jewish scholars who have studied ancient Israel and the Hebrew texts have admitted that child sacrifice to Yahweh was a common practice, evidenced even by the great prophet Micah pondering if he should sacrifice his son (ultimately, he decided against it but he seems unaware if it was forbidden). So I ask you again, where's your evidence that only the firstborn Hebrew children were circumcised? Is this the case in any passage of the Old or New Testaments? Don't be a coward and attempt to evade the facts.

I haven't evaded anything and you sir have brought no evidence to the table to rebut. As for an attack, well that would only be if I were not telling the truth, I see no evidence you know anything about the scriptures. If you think I'm stupid enough to bring you the scriptures then think again, you are the one trying to prove me wrong, you need to get busy with your study. I really get tired of atheist believing I need to supply scripture for their case, ain't going to happen.

GC

[truthBtold]

Child sacrifice was only considered evil when it was done in the name of a foreign god, and doing so was punishable by death precisely because it was offered to another deity (Leviticus 20:2; 18:21 (Deuteronomy 12:31; 18:10).

[Mudhammam]

I haven't evaded anything and you sir have brought no evidence to the table to rebut. As for an attack, well that would only be if I were not telling the truth, I see no evidence you know anything about the scriptures. If you think I'm stupid enough to bring you the scriptures then think again, you are the one trying to prove me wrong, you need to get busy with your study. I really get tired of atheist believing I need to supply scripture for their case, ain't going to happen.

GC

I'm glad to see you admit that you have no response to the Scriptures instructing child sacrifice (not circumcision, which was not exclusive to firstborn Hebrews and sheep and cattle--learn what you're talking about). It seems you're delusional or intellectually dishonest since you still ignore what your own Scriptures declare. There's a better chance you'll kick and scream like Isaac and the other children instructed to be sacrificed to Yahweh before you object to his deplorable sense of morality.

[Drich]

There are sporadic references forbidding the Hebrews from sacrificing their sons and daughters as burnt offerings to the god Baal, but interestingly, sacrifice to Yahweh seems perfectly acceptable:

"Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats. You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day." (Exodus 22:29-30).

What exactly did the Hebrews do with their cattle and sheep and firstborn children?

The word is:
נָתַן:nathan
I means to dedicate, give over, pledge..

It has nothing to do with a sacrifice.

Here are some examples of how the Hebrews treated sheep and cattle as offerings before Yahweh:

not even close. What God is commanding is an offering of the first fruits. Meaning the OT Jews had to offer the first of everything? The priest decided what they could use. The offerings of first fruits were burn or killed they were used to help widows and orphans. Offering the first born sons was a kin to pledging the service of the boy to the temple/as a priest or temple benevolence if the community needed help.
Numbers 3:12-13 explains this

11 The Lord also said to Moses, 12-13 “I destroyed all the firstborn in Egypt. At that time I chose all the firstborn from every family in Israel to be mine in a special way. That included all the firstborn men and animals. But now I am choosing the Levites to take their place. Now they will be my special servants. I, the Lord, give this command!”

"But I did obey the Lord,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the Lord assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king. The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the Lord your God at Gilgal.” But Samuel replied: “Does the Lord delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the Lord? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams. For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as king.” (1 Samuel 15:20-23)

Here Yahweh rejects the burnt offering sacrifices because his specific instructions to Saul were not obeyed, as Yahweh did in other instances when children were sacrificed to Baal. Another example:

"Solomon offered a sacrifice of fellowship offerings to the Lord: twenty-two thousand cattle and a hundred and twenty thousand sheep and goats. So the king and all the Israelites dedicated the temple of the Lord. On that same day the king consecrated the middle part of the courtyard in front of the temple of the Lord, and there he offered burnt offerings, grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings, because the bronze altar that stood before the Lord was too small to hold the burnt offerings, the grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings." (1 Kings 8:63-64)

All those poor sheep and cattle... slaughtered and burned as sacrifices to Yahweh. Remember, "You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep."

Anyone who doubts that Yahweh was calling for Hebrew children to be slaughtered, doubt no more! Ezekiel explicitly records a very angry Yahweh admitting: "Also with uplifted hand I swore to them in the wilderness that I would disperse them among the nations and scatter them through the countries, because they had not obeyed my laws but had rejected my decrees and desecrated my Sabbaths, and their eyes lusted after their parents’ idols. So I gave them other statutes that were not good and laws through which they could not live; I defiled them through their gifts—the sacrifice of every firstborn—that I might fill them with horror so they would know that I am the Lord." (Ezekiel 20:23-26)

Ah, no.

[Lemonvariable72]

There are sporadic references forbidding the Hebrews from sacrificing their sons and daughters as burnt offerings to the god Baal, but interestingly, sacrifice to Yahweh seems perfectly acceptable:

"Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats. You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day." (Exodus 22:29-30).

What exactly did the Hebrews do with their cattle and sheep and firstborn children?

The word is:
נָתַן:nathan
I means to dedicate, give over, pledge..

It has nothing to do with a sacrifice.

Here are some examples of how the Hebrews treated sheep and cattle as offerings before Yahweh:

not even close. What God is commanding is an offering of the first fruits. Meaning the OT Jews had to offer the first of everything? The priest decided what they could use. The offerings of first fruits were burn or killed they were used to help widows and orphans. Offering the first born sons was a kin to pledging the service of the boy to the temple/as a priest or temple benevolence if the community needed help.
Numbers 3:12-13 explains this

11 The Lord also said to Moses, 12-13 “I destroyed all the firstborn in Egypt. At that time I chose all the firstborn from every family in Israel to be mine in a special way. That included all the firstborn men and animals. But now I am choosing the Levites to take their place. Now they will be my special servants. I, the Lord, give this command!”

"But I did obey the Lord,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the Lord assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king. The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the Lord your God at Gilgal.” But Samuel replied: “Does the Lord delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the Lord? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams. For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as king.” (1 Samuel 15:20-23)

Here Yahweh rejects the burnt offering sacrifices because his specific instructions to Saul were not obeyed, as Yahweh did in other instances when children were sacrificed to Baal. Another example:

"Solomon offered a sacrifice of fellowship offerings to the Lord: twenty-two thousand cattle and a hundred and twenty thousand sheep and goats. So the king and all the Israelites dedicated the temple of the Lord. On that same day the king consecrated the middle part of the courtyard in front of the temple of the Lord, and there he offered burnt offerings, grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings, because the bronze altar that stood before the Lord was too small to hold the burnt offerings, the grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings." (1 Kings 8:63-64)

All those poor sheep and cattle... slaughtered and burned as sacrifices to Yahweh. Remember, "You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep."

Anyone who doubts that Yahweh was calling for Hebrew children to be slaughtered, doubt no more! Ezekiel explicitly records a very angry Yahweh admitting: "Also with uplifted hand I swore to them in the wilderness that I would disperse them among the nations and scatter them through the countries, because they had not obeyed my laws but had rejected my decrees and desecrated my Sabbaths, and their eyes lusted after their parents’ idols. So I gave them other statutes that were not good and laws through which they could not live; I defiled them through their gifts—the sacrifice of every firstborn—that I might fill them with horror so they would know that I am the Lord." (Ezekiel 20:23-26)

Ah, no.

Drippy why do you inccesantly feel the need to be arrogant?

[Mudhammam]

There are sporadic references forbidding the Hebrews from sacrificing their sons and daughters as burnt offerings to the god Baal, but interestingly, sacrifice to Yahweh seems perfectly acceptable:

"Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats. You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day." (Exodus 22:29-30).

What exactly did the Hebrews do with their cattle and sheep and firstborn children?

The word is:
נָתַן:nathan
I means to dedicate, give over, pledge..

It has nothing to do with a sacrifice.

Here are some examples of how the Hebrews treated sheep and cattle as offerings before Yahweh:

not even close. What God is commanding is an offering of the first fruits. Meaning the OT Jews had to offer the first of everything? The priest decided what they could use. The offerings of first fruits were burn or killed they were used to help widows and orphans. Offering the first born sons was a kin to pledging the service of the boy to the temple/as a priest or temple benevolence if the community needed help.
Numbers 3:12-13 explains this

11 The Lord also said to Moses, 12-13 “I destroyed all the firstborn in Egypt. At that time I chose all the firstborn from every family in Israel to be mine in a special way. That included all the firstborn men and animals. But now I am choosing the Levites to take their place. Now they will be my special servants. I, the Lord, give this command!”

"But I did obey the Lord,” Saul said. “I went on the mission the Lord assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king. The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the Lord your God at Gilgal.” But Samuel replied: “Does the Lord delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the Lord? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams. For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as king.” (1 Samuel 15:20-23)

Here Yahweh rejects the burnt offering sacrifices because his specific instructions to Saul were not obeyed, as Yahweh did in other instances when children were sacrificed to Baal. Another example:

"Solomon offered a sacrifice of fellowship offerings to the Lord: twenty-two thousand cattle and a hundred and twenty thousand sheep and goats. So the king and all the Israelites dedicated the temple of the Lord. On that same day the king consecrated the middle part of the courtyard in front of the temple of the Lord, and there he offered burnt offerings, grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings, because the bronze altar that stood before the Lord was too small to hold the burnt offerings, the grain offerings and the fat of the fellowship offerings." (1 Kings 8:63-64)

All those poor sheep and cattle... slaughtered and burned as sacrifices to Yahweh. Remember, "You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep."

Anyone who doubts that Yahweh was calling for Hebrew children to be slaughtered, doubt no more! Ezekiel explicitly records a very angry Yahweh admitting: "Also with uplifted hand I swore to them in the wilderness that I would disperse them among the nations and scatter them through the countries, because they had not obeyed my laws but had rejected my decrees and desecrated my Sabbaths, and their eyes lusted after their parents’ idols. So I gave them other statutes that were not good and laws through which they could not live; I defiled them through their gifts—the sacrifice of every firstborn—that I might fill them with horror so they would know that I am the Lord." (Ezekiel 20:23-26)

Ah, no.

"With what shall I come before the Lord
and bow down before the exalted God?
Shall I come before him with burnt offerings,
with calves a year old?
Will the Lord be pleased with thousands of rams,
with ten thousand rivers of olive oil?
Shall I offer my firstborn for my transgression,
the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?" - Micah 6:6-7

Oh yes, offering his firstborn, Micah pondered, as "the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul," was only meant "figuratively" as a "dedication," having nothing to do with sacrifice... I'm sure Drich doesn't read the story of Abraham and Isaac as a command from God for a "real sacrifice" either, just a "dedication" (albeit one involving an alter, rope, and a large knife). Sure.

[Polaris]

Ezekiel 20 points to the fact that God allowed other nations and their statues to rule over His people because they had lost their way. It was basically like "you really want to see if the grass is greener? By all means and don't let the door hit you on the way out."

Exodus 20 is about the dedication of priests to the Levites. It has been assumed that it was not an actual tribe per say but a caste of those suited for priestly duties. I assume that was why there was a tithe as these priests had to forsake their inheritance to take on their roles. I'm not sure if marriage was allowed or not for the priests.

[Minimalist]

11 The Lord also said to Moses, 12-13 “I destroyed all the firstborn in Egypt. At that time I chose all the firstborn from every family in Israel to be mine in a special way. That included all the firstborn men and animals. But now I am choosing the Levites to take their place. Now they will be my special servants. I, the Lord, give this command!”

BTW, Drippy. None of that shit ever happened. Just a fantasy. Fiction to keep the dolts in line.