What's your opinion of sharking?

[Zidneya]

Bibliofagus

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An therefore it's pedophilia, voyeurism, a net of child abuse, of depravity that will lead a bunch of teens to anarchy terrorism they will exterminate us, kill us, destroy the human race, eradicate the life on the planet, and destroy this world, the whole solar system will be destroyed, and then the galaxy. The universe as we know it will change forever.

Not sure what you mean here. Are you saying footage of underaged naked girls is not child porn because it doesn't 'destroy the human race'?
I mean: wtf?

It’s called
Reductio ad absurdum
If you think that a kid pulling a skirt is gonna turn into a pedophilia pornographic rapist voyeuristic therefore I decided to join you and take it a step furder an just like you exaggerate the situation into bigger proportions (it’s my way of saying
yeah that’s how you sound)

It's not a prank. It's the publishing of fucking child's porn.

No coitus therefor no porn, I now that the line between nudity and pornography is very thin(sometimes to the point of non existing) but that’s my opinion. If you want to debate this create your own thread and I’ll be gladly participate.
Also what if the victim is an adult? What you think that kids only do pranks to other kids?

Well... If you think the publishing of child's porn can be classified as a 'prank', I'm wondering what else you could lump into that category.

No coitus no porn.
My 2 year old niece appeared naked while my cousin(her mother) took a picture of both of us. She was naked, she is a minor, is that porn?(I’ll repeat it yea that's how you sound)

Besides, what you think that a teen criminal don't have feelings as well?

No. Where did you get that?

From your main focus only on the victims side. Since you have left by the side the possible regret and therefor forgiveness of the perpetrator. I believe in second chances I believe in redemption I believe that if a kid do something bad and he fully regrets this he can learn from this and become a better person but he wont have that chance if we sent him to prison where he will be constantly abused(sexually), beaten and mocked.

That a teen criminal can't be confused?

No. Where did you get that?

From your inability to aknowedge that teenage years are very confusing and therefor a teenage criminal in certain level don’t know what he is doing and therefore he needs guidance not an adult punishment.

That if we don't punish the they won't feel empathy at all?

They didn't feel any empathy before assaulting the woman and becoming a publisher of child's porn, so I'm wondering why you think they will afterwards.

People have this thing called regret, shame, and blame. You didn’t watch the video of the breakfast club that I posted earlier?

They are still human being. And not only human being but teenagers(no seriously I feel sorry for your kids, if they ever make mistake.

If my kids ever publish naked footage of underage girls on the web, there will be serious consequences. I'd sure as hell take em to the cops. They would get therapy. All internetpriviledges will be taken away.

I don’t care about the privileges, I encourage therapy. But what if they go to jail and when they get back they became this totally awful person. I gotta news for you Einstein prison change people and there’s no guarantee that for the best.

I hope the have a bunch of loyal friend because with parents like you

You don't know shit about me.

Oh a hit a nerve didn’t I. Hehehe.

You didn't even bother to ask me what I would do, but instead you just choose to make some shit up.

It’s called hypothetical situation.

But hey. Are you saying my friends should undermine my authority over my kids like this?

In my high school a lot of my friends got pregnant. And when they lecture their kids in front of me I accuse them how hypocrite they are since I who knew them from their teenage years know that when they were at their age they were neither better nor different than them. Kids are the future so I’ll take their side any day of the week.

I will be traumatic for me growing up knowing that if I screw something up my family it's gonna crucify me, and I will hate them for that).

I'm not saying kids should be 'crucified' over - any - misstep.

No just send them to jail, spent one night there just one night and tell me if you wish to sent your son in there.

I'm not even saying they should be punished as hard as an adult.

Good, them back me up, because that is exactly my posture and yet anyone around here seems to care.

All I'm saying is that 'sharking' is assault and publishing footage of sharking is publishing footage of underaged naked girls. Which in my country is called 'child's porn'.

And we all know that if the majority catalog something as true that makes them true right?

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Esquilax

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So that's to the question:
Am I the only one in this forum who made pranks and mistakes in his youth and enjoyed them, regret them and therefor learn to show more empathy to teenagers since I know from personal experience how confusing, exiting and those years were?
That a No from Esquilax I assume.

Actually, it kinda is: I was a pretty well behaved kid, all's told.

Then you don’t now what it feels to break the rules, the law and be free. My condolences.
Me on the other hand. I’m a rebel.

But your question does lead to another question: do pranks for you always entail the forcible manhandling and molestation of strangers?

No. Only if the person has a predisposition to me a dick, or a indifference to me moral. Let’s be a realistic the kind of kid that has a predisposition to grow up to be a sexual assaulter has more chances to get there either by sharking or not during his youth.

you say that these are pranks. We disagree. Continuing to call them pranks, from my point of view, is simply you continuing to do the problematic thing that caused me to speak up in the first place, namely downplaying the severity of what's going on.

I’m sorry but a kid pulling up a piece of clothes while some other kid films it doesn’t automatically turns them into a pedophiles, child abuser criminal pornographic filmmaker that deserves to go to prison to be beaten and bullies and sexually assaulted. When I saw those video I was laughing.

Yet you have made very clear that you don't want to treat them as kids.

Nor I want to treat them as an adults. I want them to treat them as teenagers, There’s more in our stage of life than kids and adults Esquilax. Actually I’m more inclined to treat them as kids. I strongly have show all over this discussion my disapproval to treat them as adults.

Yes. When you commit an adult crime, you have left the area of social niceties where you can be treated with kid gloves.

Yeah because we all know that making a mistake turns you into a man right? Independence won’t make you a man. Earning your salary won’t make you a man. Having sex won’t make you a man. Listen up everybody. You want to be taken seriously as n adult. Capture a how your friend pulls up a cloth of a innocent girl. That is the road to maturity.

Oh, and also? Just so we're clear: this is not just kids. There is porn of this shit.

If you catch an adult doing this the law is free to punish him the best way they saw fit and I won’t say anything.
Also you’ll have to be a little more specific. If a kid tries to rape a girl after doing this I strongly disapprove and think that he indeed needs to be sent to prison(but if he shwos regret then I am willing to make the sentence shorter however I will leave sexual aggressor in his expedient and warn people to be careful with him). But my main focus are the kids that only pull the clothes of. I’m not gonna show concern for the rapist as well. Just so we're clear, today we can find any kind of pornographic act that will encourage people to sexually assault others in pretty much any kind of situation.
So the sexual aggressor originated the porn, or the porn originated sexual aggressor? What came first the chicken or the egg. And therefore at this point is relevant the answer? Will it change something?

"Your honor, I should be tried as though I were a teenager!"

"But you're forty years old!"

"Yes, but I'm young at heart!"

At what point do you stop, with reasoning like that? And why?

Obviously there a limit age at what you can’t be tried as an adult. Independently of how young you consider yourself. Don’t be ridiculous. If an older person says this he obviously need a psychiatric evaluation to determine if he should be tried as an adult or a mentally deficient person.

Yeah because if I’m willing to cut some slack to a boy that he still think like a minor therefor I’m willing to be indulgent to any person independently of how old they are to be indulgent of them as well right? That’s you reasoning? Right?
It’s like me saying I approve throwing kids into the water so they can learn how to swim so take out the boat throw the little jimmy(who has never swim in his life) 1 mile from the coast by the time he will reach the shore he will know how to swim.(yea that's you sound)

And again, I reiterate: sometimes the film of this stuff ends up on porn sites.

You have any idea how many public videos, footage and material end up in porn sites?

In fact I'd never even heard the term before I came across it on an adult streaming website.

Then you should just wider your horizon don’t you think?

This is not just some prank

Only the ones that escalate in grooping and raping. Those are very few cases. Actually let’s be realistic. When that happens it’s because the criminal isn’t hiding to tke a piece of clothes but he has already decided to rape the victim. That’s premeditation.

and we can't exactly pretend that it doesn't have some sexual dimension for the perpetrators either

So people who took pieces of clothes to women have sex in their mind!! Really!! Good you tell me I wouldn’t have figured out by myself(sarcasm).

it isn't a coincidence that even the OP's quoted description of sharking describes the victims, specifically and exclusively, as female.

Have you tried to undress a man Esquilax? It’s not an easy job.

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DramaQueen

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I've never done a prank, it's too much drama anyway

Only if the person who receives the prank isn’t mature nor confident enough to handle it. But pranks are a good way to spent your time.
There two love each other despite every awful thing they have done to each other.
https://www.youtube.com/user/BFvsGF/videos

How can someone do such a thing to their parents? hock:

Emm not every parent children relationship it’s the same.

Op..imagine a gay guy doing it to you.

Don’t you mean gay teen?
And if it’s an acquaintance ill kick his ass. But if it’s a teen I would hesitate in calling the police.
Why it has to be gay? Unless he rapes me.But let’s be realistic if he does that he was gonna do that with or without the sharking.

He put this in philosophy? I forgot that there were categories in the forum

Should teens be judged as adults for committing sharking? Isn’t a philosophical question?

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Losty

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This. So much this. When I was a teenager I once drank all of my dad's melon juice and filled the bottle with pickle juice.

Ohh this is getting interesting keep going

My dad hates pickles.

I don’t blame him. Destroy all the pickles, for the sake of humanity!!

The amusement was worth the punishment, but I was punished and he didn't think it was funny at all.

I don’t blame him, damn pickles damn you!.

It was a harmless prank, strangely lacking of sexual assault.

It’s okay still I enjoyed the story.

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FatAndFaithless

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"Boys will be boys" doesn't cut it.

INDULGENCE ISN’T ALL FORGIVING!! What! Do I need to star selling T-shirts for you to get it!

Just imagine it the other way around. If the prank was women coming up behind men and yanking down their shorts in public while filming their reaction then running away while laughing.

Yeah keep going.

Doubtful I'd look at it as "girls will be girls"

More like naughty girls. Very very naughty girls.

and we shouldn't give that crappy excuse for men either. Just don't fucking touch people, simple.

Yeah, call me when warning teenagers get’s results in the meantime I like to focus on what’s happening right know and how to deal with it.

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Chas

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It is assault and battery.

Only in some of the most extreme cases most of the time they just grab the clothes, drop it and run away.

Is that you PhatMatt?

I dunno what PhatMatt means.

The arrogant psychopathic attitude shines through.

Ohh stop. You're making me blush.

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alpha male

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Regarding the age argument and "minor" assault: if you give teens a pass on "minor" sexual assault, when they're adults they're more likely to graduate to major assault and rape.

An therefore it's pedophilia, voyeurism, a net of child abuse, of depravity that will lead a bunch of teens to anarchy terrorism they will exterminate us, kill us, destroy the human race, eradicate the life on the planet, and destroy this world, the whole solar system will be destroyed, and then the galaxy. The universe as we know it will change forever. (Reductio ad absurdum, for more information click in the Bibliofagus reply)
In high school they put a mirror on the floor to see underwear, so far none of my classmates turned out to be a rapist.

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Aoi Magi

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It's borderline rape....

But no rape, just borderline.

reminds me of 'chikan'

Ohh yeah how many memories.
http://www.mangahere.co/manga/golden_boy...003/2.html
But in most of this cases the teens just after grabbing the clothes they just left running. The groping part is very rare.

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Downbeatplumb

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Sexually motivated assault with intent to humiliate. Not a million miles away from rape really.

Most of the cases they don’t know the victim therefore is hard to assume that it’s because they are trying to humiliate. Also don’t discount the sticky presence of ejaculation my friend.

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Thumpalumpacus

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When I was fourteen, I got arrested for breaking into cars. My buddy and I had thousands of dollars worth of stuff, and we were tried and convicted, rightfully, of grand theft. Being as it was my first offense, I served probation only; and being as I was a juvenile, my record has been sealed. I have not gotten into trouble with the law in any way in the intervening 33 years.

Now tell me what would have happened if you wouldn’t have gotten probation? What if! And let’s be realistic that’s a big what if.
Do you think that if they have tried as an adult what would have happened. Because that’s the topic that I’m discussing with this people. The think it’s okay to tried a teen as an adult. They think that sending kids to prison is the right thing to do to them. But let’s be realistic they don’t care about them at all yet they are claiming morality, but morality without a certain degree of compassion an empathy is empty, I mean it’s not like I telling them to forgive Al quaeda terrorist, I’m just telling them to be more indulgent with abunch of stupid teenagers.

However, none of that -- my youth, my good living since then, my discharge of my probation -- none of that changes the fact that what I did was commit a crime.

And none of that changes the fact that if someone wouldn’t have been more tolerable because of your age your life would have been a lot more different.

Forcibly stripping a person, be it public or private, performed by an adult or by youth, is a crime.

I never said it wasn’t I’m discussing the nurture and degree of the crime. An the contet of it along with the circumstances of the perpetrator.

Youth might mitigate the sentence, as it did in my case

Watch out Thumpalumpacus I just said those exact same words and people got really upset claiming that it is wrong doing that. And if they don’t complain
about you like they did to me. Tell me the secret.

That's certainly something you'd never say to his face.

Of course not. But let’s be realistic, he lives miles away, and if I ever try to seduce his wife that doesn’t mean she fall for me. It’s just hypothetical situation. Believe I had a friend during my twenties saying that he wanted me to borrow ma(at that time) girlfriend I just told him that; why the hell are you saying me this. Do the traditional way at least behind my back but don’t keep telling me that or I’m gonna punch you.

What a braveheart you are!

I just don’t have much respect for marriage that’s all.

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Jenny

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It's beyond a prank.

No it isn’t. You just don’t find it funny. Much kinds of vandalism and asaultas are made by pranks you know.

But to get all legally technical, it isn't an assault, it's a battery. An assault is merely the threat of battery.

In a nutshell the elements of battery are:

1) an intent to make contact with the plaintiff which reasonable people would consider harmful or offensive to the plaintiff; 2) actual contact with the plaintiff which reasonable people would consider harmful or offensive; 3) plaintiff is actually harmed or offended by the contact.

No doubt the "pranksters" intend to pull at the the victims clothing. Reasonable people would expect that action to be offensive to the victim. The victim is indeed humiliated and offended. Thus battery.

I’m seriously gratefull that you see the situation as it is.

Many states have definitions for rape that include unwanted sexual touching.

many startes are just stupid.

So there are places this might be some degree of rape as well.

Just as complaining for the government is considered anarchy and terrorism but let’s be realistic if complaining about the government was a bad thing you guys will be still English. If there isn’t no coitus nor ejaculation it isn’t rape for me

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Rhythm

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I thought this was going to be about fishing........fuck you OP, harshing my mellow.

Sorrry!!! I didn’t mean to.

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Beccs

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I call it sexual assault.

But on what degree? And will you be indulgent if the criminal is a teen?

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BrianSoddingBoru4

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it was harmless. Then again, I never said you did. What I said that people who do this and are not punished for it are going to get the impression that it is harmless.

People have this thing called regret, shame, and blame. You didn’t watch the video of the breakfast club that I posted earlier?

people Please make more of an effort to respond to what I said rather than what you wish I had said.

Eh… sorry? I think?

*chuckle* I'm not in the least concerned.

Why would you we live distance away and I dunno who is your wife.

Sadly - for you, anyroad - my missus has standards

Theres a Casanova named Mauricio Graces who heard that same statement and he said:
Don’t worry I’ll remove that defect rapidly.
, and

I can assure you that they do not include people who view sharking as youthful high spirits.

Good because I will never tell her that, the first date would be very akward if it did.

And for the record, it is herself that would do the stomping.
Trust me - she wears the boots that can do it.

It’s okay, if she likes sadism, I don’t judge.

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JesusHChrist

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So I'm guessing the OP now knows our opinion on sharking.

Why? Why would they? I still think that one should be more indulgent with teens. So I think I’m pretty much were I started.

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. Don't do it!

More like don't do the thread if you don't have the time to reply.

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bennyboy

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I don't know if I have a vote, but I'd say this post merits the ban hammer.

Why?

Zidneya is clearly trolling

Why? I’m addressing the topic, using rational arguments, not avoiding the replies and reading each reply. How is that trolling? Just because I don’t agree with everyone is that trolling?

the OP itself is clearly not a serious attempt at philosophy,

yeah, but the debate escalated to if either teens should or shouldn’t be tried as adults because of their crimes. And that on the other hand is a serious philosophical debate. Believe me if I could change the opening message to adrees thid topic from beginning I would.

but rather an attempt to stir up negative feelings.

And why is my fault that anyone else in this forum knows what is like to be confused, and break the law during their youth?

Not only that, the way Zid has handled subsequent comments shows an aggressive disrespect for women and anyone who cares about a woman.

Why? Because I show concern for the teen criminals? Did I ever said that this acts will go unnoticed? I’m just saying that sending teen to prison for grabbing women’s cloth isn’t worth doing a whole amount of prison time. That only will be counter productive, to the teen criminals, society and their families. So excuse me if I show compassion for those who you ain’t willing to show compassion.

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Darkstar

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One needs to draw a line between "harmless prank" and "criminal activity"

And who will do that? And what criteria would he or she use? And what if I or other people object(with rational arguments)?

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should get off with a slap on the wrist

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should go to prision to be constantly abused, assaults, beaten an extort as well.

I for one, never did any such thing.

It’s okay however what about those who did? Are you willing to forgive them To understand them?

To this day, I still cannot understand why people do malicious things like this.

People who try to save the world without understanding it what they are really trying to save is their own ego.

Why do some people have insufficient empathy?

Don’t tell that to me you are the one who isn’t showing compassion to criminal teens.

Was I an early bloomer in terms of gaining empathy, or are low empathy teens simply unapologetic scumbags?

I think that depends on the person don’t you agree?

(Or... something else? The fact that some grow up into responsible adults suggests that there may be something else to this.)

I believe in second chances I believe in redemption I believe that if a kid do something bad and he fully regrets this he can learn from this and become a better person but he wont have that chance if we sent him to prison where he will be constantly abused(sexually), beaten and mocked.
Just excuse you never made a mistake that doesn’t mean you are the perfect role model of how everyone should act. Mistakes show us who we really are.
Experience is simply the name we give our mistakes.
Oscar Wilde

When you fail you learn from the mistakes you made and it motivates you to work even harder.
Natalie Gulbis

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Okay people three things

• since there are so many replies I couldn't check them very well so sorry for spelling and grammar mistakes.
  
• I'm might not gonna reply to you again(and personally I don't want to because let's face it what could you possibly tell me that you haven't said already?), replying all of you at the same time is very tiresome. But I don't have much time since life and work it's gonna be very busy from now on(those daft punk promos don't make it by themselves you know), that's why I replied to you all at once since later I might not have much time to do it at all. And also I've explained my points stamens and posture very clear so I'll appreciate no further misunderstandings.
  
• Don't just click the reply button and leave the quotes like they are because with so many hidden replies it might get confusing or tedious.
  

[Brakeman]

Bibliofagus [hide]
[/list]

Nice formating! That shows quite the effort.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Nobody has a right to touch someone or do something to someone (like exposing them in public) unless they have agreed that's what they want.

So yeah, I'm going with assault on this as that's how it would be viewed under my country's law (England/UK).

[Aoi Magi]

Okay people three things

• since there are so many replies I couldn't check them very well so sorry for spelling and grammar mistakes.
  
• I'm might not gonna reply to you again(and personally I don't want to because let's face it what could you possibly tell me that you haven't said already?), replying all of you at the same time is very tiresome. But I don't have much time since life and work it's gonna be very busy from now on(those daft punk promos don't make it by themselves you know), that's why I replied to you all at once since later I might not have much time to do it at all. And also I've explained my points stamens and posture very clear so I'll appreciate no further misunderstandings.
  
• Don't just click the reply button and leave the quotes like they are because with so many hidden replies it might get confusing or tedious.
  

You forgot to arrange them alphabetically.

[Zidneya]

You forgot to arrange them alphabetically.

I did it chronologically.

[Aoi Magi]

I did it chronologically.

[Mudhammam]

Sharking is another example of the societal ills that befall a people who disregard the word of God.

Seriously though, what sexually repressed victim of religious indoctrination invented sharking?

[Darkstar]

One needs to draw a line between "harmless prank" and "criminal activity"

And who will do that? And what criteria would he or she use? And what if I or other people object(with rational arguments)?

Obviously lawmakers would be the only ones who could decide that, and I think the criteria could be culled from existing laws. If the "prank" also happens to be a crime, then it is by definition criminal activity.

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should get off with a slap on the wrist

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should go to prision to be constantly abused, assaults, beaten an extort as well.

They don't send minors to adult prison, do they? I never said that they should get a long prison sentence, I just meant that there should be something of substance so they fully understand the consequences of their actions.

I for one, never did any such thing.

It’s okay however what about those who did? Are you willing to forgive them To understand them?

It is difficult for me to understand them because I was never anything close to that, as for forgive; I cannot easily hold a grudge. This isn't the kind of thing you revile someone forever over, IMO. But, later forgiving someone for doing something isn't synonymous for letting them get off scot-free.

To this day, I still cannot understand why people do malicious things like this.

People who try to save the world without understanding it what they are really trying to save is their own ego.

I don't even know what that means...
I could try to guess, that not having been a prick myself it's harder for me to act like "boys will be boys", but the saving my own ego thing has me stumped.

Why do some people have insufficient empathy?

Don’t tell that to me you are the one who isn’t showing compassion to criminal teens.

Did I ever actually suggest what be done with them? How can you accurately judge how much compassion I do or do not feel?
I could accuse you of not feeling compassion for the real victims here, but I won't.

Was I an early bloomer in terms of gaining empathy, or are low empathy teens simply unapologetic scumbags?

I think that depends on the person don’t you agree?

Well, yeah, I'm sure it does. I was just wondering if sociopathic behavior is common, and my clean track record is actually abnormal.

(Or... something else? The fact that some grow up into responsible adults suggests that there may be something else to this.)

I believe in second chances I believe in redemption I believe that if a kid do something bad and he fully regrets this he can learn from this and become a better person but he wont have that chance if we sent him to prison where he will be constantly abused(sexually), beaten and mocked.

I don't think I ever said that a kid should be sent to adult prison. I don't even know what the punishment for sexual assault is; I was simply stating my observations when I noted that the pranks carried out by these kids would be legally classified as sexual assault.

Just excuse you never made a mistake that doesn’t mean you are the perfect role model of how everyone should act. Mistakes show us who we really are.

I have made mistakes (though not brushes with the law), and I'm definitely not a perfect role model, but... Wait...? "Mistakes show us who we really are" almost sounds like you're suggesting that when people do antisocial things, it's their true colors showing through, showing the world who they really are. But I'm pretty sure that's not what you meant.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Why do you guys hate ziddy?

I'm serious

I don'[t hate him. I just think he hasn't thought his position through very well.

After repeated attempts to bring him there, I'm inclined to think he's a little obtuse ... but that still isn't hatred.

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Bibliofagus

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Not sure what you mean here. Are you saying footage of underaged naked girls is not child porn because it doesn't 'destroy the human race'?
I mean: wtf?

It’s called
Reductio ad absurdum
If you think that a kid pulling a skirt is gonna turn into a pedophilia pornographic rapist voyeuristic therefore I decided to join you and take it a step furder an just like you exaggerate the situation into bigger proportions (it’s my way of saying
yeah that’s how you sound)

It's not a prank. It's the publishing of fucking child's porn.

No coitus therefor no porn, I now that the line between nudity and pornography is very thin(sometimes to the point of non existing) but that’s my opinion. If you want to debate this create your own thread and I’ll be gladly participate.
Also what if the victim is an adult? What you think that kids only do pranks to other kids?

Well... If you think the publishing of child's porn can be classified as a 'prank', I'm wondering what else you could lump into that category.

No coitus no porn.
My 2 year old niece appeared naked while my cousin(her mother) took a picture of both of us. She was naked, she is a minor, is that porn?(I’ll repeat it yea that's how you sound)

No. Where did you get that?

From your main focus only on the victims side. Since you have left by the side the possible regret and therefor forgiveness of the perpetrator. I believe in second chances I believe in redemption I believe that if a kid do something bad and he fully regrets this he can learn from this and become a better person but he wont have that chance if we sent him to prison where he will be constantly abused(sexually), beaten and mocked.

No. Where did you get that?

From your inability to aknowedge that teenage years are very confusing and therefor a teenage criminal in certain level don’t know what he is doing and therefore he needs guidance not an adult punishment.

They didn't feel any empathy before assaulting the woman and becoming a publisher of child's porn, so I'm wondering why you think they will afterwards.

People have this thing called regret, shame, and blame. You didn’t watch the video of the breakfast club that I posted earlier?

If my kids ever publish naked footage of underage girls on the web, there will be serious consequences. I'd sure as hell take em to the cops. They would get therapy. All internetpriviledges will be taken away.

I don’t care about the privileges, I encourage therapy. But what if they go to jail and when they get back they became this totally awful person. I gotta news for you Einstein prison change people and there’s no guarantee that for the best.

You don't know shit about me.

Oh a hit a nerve didn’t I. Hehehe.

You didn't even bother to ask me what I would do, but instead you just choose to make some shit up.

It’s called hypothetical situation.

But hey. Are you saying my friends should undermine my authority over my kids like this?

In my high school a lot of my friends got pregnant. And when they lecture their kids in front of me I accuse them how hypocrite they are since I who knew them from their teenage years know that when they were at their age they were neither better nor different than them. Kids are the future so I’ll take their side any day of the week.

I'm not saying kids should be 'crucified' over - any - misstep.

No just send them to jail, spent one night there just one night and tell me if you wish to sent your son in there.

I'm not even saying they should be punished as hard as an adult.

Good, them back me up, because that is exactly my posture and yet anyone around here seems to care.

All I'm saying is that 'sharking' is assault and publishing footage of sharking is publishing footage of underaged naked girls. Which in my country is called 'child's porn'.

And we all know that if the majority catalog something as true that makes them true right?

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Esquilax

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Actually, it kinda is: I was a pretty well behaved kid, all's told.

Then you don’t now what it feels to break the rules, the law and be free. My condolences.
Me on the other hand. I’m a rebel.

But your question does lead to another question: do pranks for you always entail the forcible manhandling and molestation of strangers?

No. Only if the person has a predisposition to me a dick, or a indifference to me moral. Let’s be a realistic the kind of kid that has a predisposition to grow up to be a sexual assaulter has more chances to get there either by sharking or not during his youth.

you say that these are pranks. We disagree. Continuing to call them pranks, from my point of view, is simply you continuing to do the problematic thing that caused me to speak up in the first place, namely downplaying the severity of what's going on.

I’m sorry but a kid pulling up a piece of clothes while some other kid films it doesn’t automatically turns them into a pedophiles, child abuser criminal pornographic filmmaker that deserves to go to prison to be beaten and bullies and sexually assaulted. When I saw those video I was laughing.

Yet you have made very clear that you don't want to treat them as kids.

Nor I want to treat them as an adults. I want them to treat them as teenagers, There’s more in our stage of life than kids and adults Esquilax. Actually I’m more inclined to treat them as kids. I strongly have show all over this discussion my disapproval to treat them as adults.

Yes. When you commit an adult crime, you have left the area of social niceties where you can be treated with kid gloves.

Yeah because we all know that making a mistake turns you into a man right? Independence won’t make you a man. Earning your salary won’t make you a man. Having sex won’t make you a man. Listen up everybody. You want to be taken seriously as n adult. Capture a how your friend pulls up a cloth of a innocent girl. That is the road to maturity.

Oh, and also? Just so we're clear: this is not just kids. There is porn of this shit.

If you catch an adult doing this the law is free to punish him the best way they saw fit and I won’t say anything.
Also you’ll have to be a little more specific. If a kid tries to rape a girl after doing this I strongly disapprove and think that he indeed needs to be sent to prison(but if he shwos regret then I am willing to make the sentence shorter however I will leave sexual aggressor in his expedient and warn people to be careful with him). But my main focus are the kids that only pull the clothes of. I’m not gonna show concern for the rapist as well. Just so we're clear, today we can find any kind of pornographic act that will encourage people to sexually assault others in pretty much any kind of situation.
So the sexual aggressor originated the porn, or the porn originated sexual aggressor? What came first the chicken or the egg. And therefore at this point is relevant the answer? Will it change something?

"Your honor, I should be tried as though I were a teenager!"

"But you're forty years old!"

"Yes, but I'm young at heart!"

At what point do you stop, with reasoning like that? And why?

Obviously there a limit age at what you can’t be tried as an adult. Independently of how young you consider yourself. Don’t be ridiculous. If an older person says this he obviously need a psychiatric evaluation to determine if he should be tried as an adult or a mentally deficient person.

Yeah because if I’m willing to cut some slack to a boy that he still think like a minor therefor I’m willing to be indulgent to any person independently of how old they are to be indulgent of them as well right? That’s you reasoning? Right?
It’s like me saying I approve throwing kids into the water so they can learn how to swim so take out the boat throw the little jimmy(who has never swim in his life) 1 mile from the coast by the time he will reach the shore he will know how to swim.(yea that's you sound)

And again, I reiterate: sometimes the film of this stuff ends up on porn sites.

You have any idea how many public videos, footage and material end up in porn sites?

In fact I'd never even heard the term before I came across it on an adult streaming website.

Then you should just wider your horizon don’t you think?

This is not just some prank

Only the ones that escalate in grooping and raping. Those are very few cases. Actually let’s be realistic. When that happens it’s because the criminal isn’t hiding to tke a piece of clothes but he has already decided to rape the victim. That’s premeditation.

and we can't exactly pretend that it doesn't have some sexual dimension for the perpetrators either

So people who took pieces of clothes to women have sex in their mind!! Really!! Good you tell me I wouldn’t have figured out by myself(sarcasm).

it isn't a coincidence that even the OP's quoted description of sharking describes the victims, specifically and exclusively, as female.

Have you tried to undress a man Esquilax? It’s not an easy job.

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DramaQueen

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I've never done a prank, it's too much drama anyway

Only if the person who receives the prank isn’t mature nor confident enough to handle it. But pranks are a good way to spent your time.
There two love each other despite every awful thing they have done to each other.
https://www.youtube.com/user/BFvsGF/videos

How can someone do such a thing to their parents? hock:

Emm not every parent children relationship it’s the same.

Op..imagine a gay guy doing it to you.

Don’t you mean gay teen?
And if it’s an acquaintance ill kick his ass. But if it’s a teen I would hesitate in calling the police.
Why it has to be gay? Unless he rapes me.But let’s be realistic if he does that he was gonna do that with or without the sharking.

He put this in philosophy? I forgot that there were categories in the forum

Should teens be judged as adults for committing sharking? Isn’t a philosophical question?

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Losty

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This. So much this. When I was a teenager I once drank all of my dad's melon juice and filled the bottle with pickle juice.

Ohh this is getting interesting keep going

My dad hates pickles.

I don’t blame him. Destroy all the pickles, for the sake of humanity!!

The amusement was worth the punishment, but I was punished and he didn't think it was funny at all.

I don’t blame him, damn pickles damn you!.

It was a harmless prank, strangely lacking of sexual assault.

It’s okay still I enjoyed the story.

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FatAndFaithless

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"Boys will be boys" doesn't cut it.

INDULGENCE ISN’T ALL FORGIVING!! What! Do I need to star selling T-shirts for you to get it!

Just imagine it the other way around. If the prank was women coming up behind men and yanking down their shorts in public while filming their reaction then running away while laughing.

Yeah keep going.

Doubtful I'd look at it as "girls will be girls"

More like naughty girls. Very very naughty girls.

and we shouldn't give that crappy excuse for men either. Just don't fucking touch people, simple.

Yeah, call me when warning teenagers get’s results in the meantime I like to focus on what’s happening right know and how to deal with it.

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Chas

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It is assault and battery.

Only in some of the most extreme cases most of the time they just grab the clothes, drop it and run away.

Is that you PhatMatt?

I dunno what PhatMatt means.

The arrogant psychopathic attitude shines through.

Ohh stop. You're making me blush.

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alpha male

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Regarding the age argument and "minor" assault: if you give teens a pass on "minor" sexual assault, when they're adults they're more likely to graduate to major assault and rape.

An therefore it's pedophilia, voyeurism, a net of child abuse, of depravity that will lead a bunch of teens to anarchy terrorism they will exterminate us, kill us, destroy the human race, eradicate the life on the planet, and destroy this world, the whole solar system will be destroyed, and then the galaxy. The universe as we know it will change forever. (Reductio ad absurdum, for more information click in the Bibliofagus reply)
In high school they put a mirror on the floor to see underwear, so far none of my classmates turned out to be a rapist.

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Aoi Magi

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It's borderline rape....

But no rape, just borderline.

reminds me of 'chikan'

Ohh yeah how many memories.
http://www.mangahere.co/manga/golden_boy...003/2.html
But in most of this cases the teens just after grabbing the clothes they just left running. The groping part is very rare.

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Downbeatplumb

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Sexually motivated assault with intent to humiliate. Not a million miles away from rape really.

Most of the cases they don’t know the victim therefore is hard to assume that it’s because they are trying to humiliate. Also don’t discount the sticky presence of ejaculation my friend.

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Thumpalumpacus

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When I was fourteen, I got arrested for breaking into cars. My buddy and I had thousands of dollars worth of stuff, and we were tried and convicted, rightfully, of grand theft. Being as it was my first offense, I served probation only; and being as I was a juvenile, my record has been sealed. I have not gotten into trouble with the law in any way in the intervening 33 years.

Now tell me what would have happened if you wouldn’t have gotten probation? What if! And let’s be realistic that’s a big what if.
Do you think that if they have tried as an adult what would have happened. Because that’s the topic that I’m discussing with this people. The think it’s okay to tried a teen as an adult. They think that sending kids to prison is the right thing to do to them. But let’s be realistic they don’t care about them at all yet they are claiming morality, but morality without a certain degree of compassion an empathy is empty, I mean it’s not like I telling them to forgive Al quaeda terrorist, I’m just telling them to be more indulgent with abunch of stupid teenagers.

However, none of that -- my youth, my good living since then, my discharge of my probation -- none of that changes the fact that what I did was commit a crime.

And none of that changes the fact that if someone wouldn’t have been more tolerable because of your age your life would have been a lot more different.

Forcibly stripping a person, be it public or private, performed by an adult or by youth, is a crime.

I never said it wasn’t I’m discussing the nurture and degree of the crime. An the contet of it along with the circumstances of the perpetrator.

Youth might mitigate the sentence, as it did in my case

Watch out Thumpalumpacus I just said those exact same words and people got really upset claiming that it is wrong doing that. And if they don’t complain
about you like they did to me. Tell me the secret.

That's certainly something you'd never say to his face.

Of course not. But let’s be realistic, he lives miles away, and if I ever try to seduce his wife that doesn’t mean she fall for me. It’s just hypothetical situation. Believe I had a friend during my twenties saying that he wanted me to borrow ma(at that time) girlfriend I just told him that; why the hell are you saying me this. Do the traditional way at least behind my back but don’t keep telling me that or I’m gonna punch you.

What a braveheart you are!

I just don’t have much respect for marriage that’s all.

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Jenny

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It's beyond a prank.

No it isn’t. You just don’t find it funny. Much kinds of vandalism and asaultas are made by pranks you know.

But to get all legally technical, it isn't an assault, it's a battery. An assault is merely the threat of battery.

In a nutshell the elements of battery are:

1) an intent to make contact with the plaintiff which reasonable people would consider harmful or offensive to the plaintiff; 2) actual contact with the plaintiff which reasonable people would consider harmful or offensive; 3) plaintiff is actually harmed or offended by the contact.

No doubt the "pranksters" intend to pull at the the victims clothing. Reasonable people would expect that action to be offensive to the victim. The victim is indeed humiliated and offended. Thus battery.

I’m seriously gratefull that you see the situation as it is.

Many states have definitions for rape that include unwanted sexual touching.

many startes are just stupid.

So there are places this might be some degree of rape as well.

Just as complaining for the government is considered anarchy and terrorism but let’s be realistic if complaining about the government was a bad thing you guys will be still English. If there isn’t no coitus nor ejaculation it isn’t rape for me

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Rhythm

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I thought this was going to be about fishing........fuck you OP, harshing my mellow.

Sorrry!!! I didn’t mean to.

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Beccs

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I call it sexual assault.

But on what degree? And will you be indulgent if the criminal is a teen?

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BrianSoddingBoru4

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it was harmless. Then again, I never said you did. What I said that people who do this and are not punished for it are going to get the impression that it is harmless.

People have this thing called regret, shame, and blame. You didn’t watch the video of the breakfast club that I posted earlier?

people Please make more of an effort to respond to what I said rather than what you wish I had said.

Eh… sorry? I think?

*chuckle* I'm not in the least concerned.

Why would you we live distance away and I dunno who is your wife.

Sadly - for you, anyroad - my missus has standards

Theres a Casanova named Mauricio Graces who heard that same statement and he said:
Don’t worry I’ll remove that defect rapidly.
, and

I can assure you that they do not include people who view sharking as youthful high spirits.

Good because I will never tell her that, the first date would be very akward if it did.

And for the record, it is herself that would do the stomping.
Trust me - she wears the boots that can do it.

It’s okay, if she likes sadism, I don’t judge.

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JesusHChrist

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So I'm guessing the OP now knows our opinion on sharking.

Why? Why would they? I still think that one should be more indulgent with teens. So I think I’m pretty much were I started.

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. Don't do it!

More like don't do the thread if you don't have the time to reply.

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bennyboy

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I don't know if I have a vote, but I'd say this post merits the ban hammer.

Why?

Zidneya is clearly trolling

Why? I’m addressing the topic, using rational arguments, not avoiding the replies and reading each reply. How is that trolling? Just because I don’t agree with everyone is that trolling?

the OP itself is clearly not a serious attempt at philosophy,

yeah, but the debate escalated to if either teens should or shouldn’t be tried as adults because of their crimes. And that on the other hand is a serious philosophical debate. Believe me if I could change the opening message to adrees thid topic from beginning I would.

but rather an attempt to stir up negative feelings.

And why is my fault that anyone else in this forum knows what is like to be confused, and break the law during their youth?

Not only that, the way Zid has handled subsequent comments shows an aggressive disrespect for women and anyone who cares about a woman.

Why? Because I show concern for the teen criminals? Did I ever said that this acts will go unnoticed? I’m just saying that sending teen to prison for grabbing women’s cloth isn’t worth doing a whole amount of prison time. That only will be counter productive, to the teen criminals, society and their families. So excuse me if I show compassion for those who you ain’t willing to show compassion.

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Darkstar

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One needs to draw a line between "harmless prank" and "criminal activity"

And who will do that? And what criteria would he or she use? And what if I or other people object(with rational arguments)?

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should get off with a slap on the wrist

Just because the perpetrators aren't adults doesn't mean they should go to prision to be constantly abused, assaults, beaten an extort as well.

I for one, never did any such thing.

It’s okay however what about those who did? Are you willing to forgive them To understand them?

To this day, I still cannot understand why people do malicious things like this.

People who try to save the world without understanding it what they are really trying to save is their own ego.

Why do some people have insufficient empathy?

Don’t tell that to me you are the one who isn’t showing compassion to criminal teens.

Was I an early bloomer in terms of gaining empathy, or are low empathy teens simply unapologetic scumbags?

I think that depends on the person don’t you agree?

(Or... something else? The fact that some grow up into responsible adults suggests that there may be something else to this.)

I believe in second chances I believe in redemption I believe that if a kid do something bad and he fully regrets this he can learn from this and become a better person but he wont have that chance if we sent him to prison where he will be constantly abused(sexually), beaten and mocked.
Just excuse you never made a mistake that doesn’t mean you are the perfect role model of how everyone should act. Mistakes show us who we really are.
Experience is simply the name we give our mistakes.
Oscar Wilde

When you fail you learn from the mistakes you made and it motivates you to work even harder.
Natalie Gulbis

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Okay people three things

• since there are so many replies I couldn't check them very well so sorry for spelling and grammar mistakes.
  
• I'm might not gonna reply to you again(and personally I don't want to because let's face it what could you possibly tell me that you haven't said already?), replying all of you at the same time is very tiresome. But I don't have much time since life and work it's gonna be very busy from now on(those daft punk promos don't make it by themselves you know), that's why I replied to you all at once since later I might not have much time to do it at all. And also I've explained my points stamens and posture very clear so I'll appreciate no further misunderstandings.
  
• Don't just click the reply button and leave the quotes like they are because with so many hidden replies it might get confusing or tedious.
  

WTF, you ignored my point?

Dipshit.

[Zidneya]

Darkstar

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Obviously lawmakers would be the only ones who could decide that

Yeah because Lawmakers are the perfect example of moral judgment.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/l...signs.html

and rational thinking:
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyath...t-the-irs/

Besides what? just because a lawmaker promulgates a law will that stop people from object(with rational arguments)? Or that it will make it good. You have any idea how many unfair laws are in the world.

If the "prank" also happens to be a crime, then it is by definition criminal activity.

Okay I gotta ask when did I said that this pranks weren't criminal activities? Pranks can be performed in by commenting vandalism and defamation as well. Does that stop them from being pranks? Does that stop them from being criminal activities?

They don't send minors to adult prison, do they?

Have you ever been to a juvie? Same hell only that those who make it a living hell are minors.

It is difficult for me to understand them because I was never anything close to that

It has been my experience that folks who have no vices have very few virtues. Abraham Lincoln (1809 - 1865)

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But, later forgiving someone for doing something isn't synonymous for letting them get off scot-free.

And also I've explained my points stamens and posture very clear so I'll appreciate no further misunderstandings.

BUT LIKE I SAID BEFORE JUST BECAUSE I'M WILLING TO BE INDULGENT THAT DOESN'T MEAN I'M WILLING TO THIS ASSAULTS GO UNPUNISHED.

INDULGENCE ISN’T ALL FORGIVING!! What! Do I need to star selling T-shirts for you to get it!

I swear I hear one more freaking time anyone else accusing me of saying that I'm willing to let this crimes go unforgiving and I will leave this thread. Because how can I believe that even after 8 freaking pages people still can't get that that's not my posture at all!!
Okay when did I said that I was willing to letting them get off scot-free.

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People who try to save the world without understanding it what they are really trying to save is their own ego.

I don't even know what that means...

I means. How can you decide what's good or bad for other people if you don't take five seconds to understand other people. What you think that everyone else thinks like you? Or that they should think like you? When you claim your moral judgments are coronet but at the same time you don't even take an effort to understand other people I have to ask. What you are saying is the right thing for the world or to yourself?

I could try to guess, that not having been a prick myself it's harder for me to act like "boys will be boys".

Some of the most horrible things in the world happened at the hands of boys but that doesn't take out the fact that they are still boys.(now you see why I posted this on the Philosophy section)

Did I ever actually suggest what be done with them? How can you accurately judge how much compassion I do or do not feel?

By you inability to try to understand them. I get that you never made a prank but apparently that has become a excuse for you.
If you look at your previous statement you'll see the following.

I was a good boy therefor I don't understand them and therefor I will cease any effort or attempt in trying to understand them.
I gotta ask you never felt the imp use or desire to break the rules? To do something even after knowing that everyone else would judge you badly for that? To have some fun and no worrying about the consequences? Most of the people who commit pranks have thought this. And I have a hard time in believing that you never experienced any of this.

I could accuse you of not feeling compassion for the real victims here, but I won't.

I feel as much compassion for the victims as anyone. But I don't let this cloud the fact that the perpetrators are still teens (and therefor they deserve compassion as well).

Well, yeah, I'm sure it does. I was just wondering if sociopathic behavior is common, and my clean track record is actually abnormal.

In high school they put a mirror on the floor to see underwear, so far none of my classmates turned out to be a rapist. I get that many sociopaths didn't woke up one morning being a total monsters. I get that they committed crime after crime each time increasing the level of cruelty. Therefor I understand why you worry that if you don't stop them they might become a treat. But that depends on the person as well don't you agree. I mean in my high school they put a mirror on the floor to see underwear, so far none of my classmates turned out to be a rapist, nor mysogynist nor sociopath.
Now tell me why do you think this happened? Because no teacher caught them. So tell me what did they did wrong? Why didn't they turned id rapist or sociopaths or criminals?
My original statement reins in this topic. let's be realistic the kind of boy that is apt to turn into a sociopath will do it either by sharking or he simply will fin out something else.

I don't think I ever said that a kid should be sent to adult prison.

Then I must apologize to you. Bu is just that I've heard that stamens again during this thread that I ssumed. I even asked before:

I gotta ask when I say understanding and tolerable does that mean that Im willing to let go ever drug blackout rapist walk free down the street?
It' all the same with you isn't it black or white. Condemned them with all the force of the law or don't condemn them at all isn't it?

And so far many(and I mean many) have claimed that they should be tried as adults, and therefor sent to prison.

I don't even know what the punishment for sexual assault is

It depends on the country, age, circumstances, and identity of both the victim and criminal.

I was simply stating my observations when I noted that the pranks carried out by these kids would be legally classified as sexual assault.

Okay.

I have made mistakes (though not brushes with the law), and I'm definitely not a perfect role model, but... Wait...? "Mistakes show us who we really are" almost sounds like you're suggesting that when people do antisocial things, it's their true colors showing through , showing the world who they really are. But I'm pretty sure that's not what you meant.

Actually thats exactly what I meant.
If a person rapes a teen isn't he showing us our true colors? If a persona ran over a person ant either left or stays to take the responsibility isn't showing us our true colors?
Yhis much I know, when the storm breaks, some are dumb with terror and some spread their wings like eagles and soar.
John Dee 1527-1609

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Thumpalumpacus

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I don'[t hate him. I just think he hasn't thought his position through very well.

WTF, you ignored my point?

Then could you repeat your point again.Thumpalumpacus

Don't just click the reply button and leave the quotes like they are because with so many hidden replies it might get confusing or tedious.

And you ignore my point as well, so who are you to complain.

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okay I'm gonna post my position so there will be no further misunderstanding.
Because I'm sick and tired of them.

• I don't think that a teen who comits sharking will certainly grow up to be a rapist or a sociopath.
  
• We should be indulgent with teen criminals who commit sharking.
  
• We wouldn't tried them as adults(because they aren't adults)
  
• No! I'm not ignoring the feelings of the victims.
  
• No I'm not saying this acts aren't crimes.
  
• No I'm not saying this crimes stop being pranks.
  
• No I'm not saying this crimes should be unnoticed nor unpunished.
  
• I don think that sending this kids to prison will neither solve the problem nor help them at all.
  
• Yes I care for the teen criminals(because they are still human beings and teenagers).
  
• I STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY IS SO DAMN DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND THIS POINTS?(I'm not asking you to share them people I just wish that someone will take five second to read them and say: Oh so that is what zidneya thinks of sharking)