R -E - S - P - E - C - T: Who gets it and who decides?

[Whateverist]

Respect, as I'm using the word, refers to the esteem that some people elicit from us and others don't. Still others elicit the opposite reaction. We find them despicable and revile them.

But respect is about what we feel. What became clear in the closed thread is that many/most of us place more stock in how people behave than in what they feel or believe.

Tolerance is a stance and prerequisite to good manners. These are instilled in youth (or not) and further conditioned by our life experiences thereafter. It doesn't seem reasonable to hold people accountable for the conditioning their life circumstances have thrown their way, but behavior is another matter.

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If you're an atheist, do you hold theist in low esteem because of their god belief? If you're a theist, do you hold atheists in low esteem because of their rejection of god belief?

Personally, I find god belief doesn't automatically dampen the respect I have for a stranger. However, the more I learn about how that belief is held, the needle on the respect-0-meter can either go up or down. The more a theist claims certainty in their god belief, the more I notice it adversely affecting their capacity for sound reasoning. When their behavior toward others in the service of their god belief becomes pushy, pompous, condescending, manipulative, dishonest .. the needle can plummet to zero. But the same can happen when a stranger's lack of god-belief leads them to treat believers with contempt for no other reason than what it is they believe, well then again the needle plummets. In both cases, there seems to be some amount of reason-impairment and when that leads to poor treatment of others they lose respect from me.

In the last thread, I made the mistake of 'calling out' examples of theists whose reasoning and manners I respect, some others whose struggles I have empathy for and so no lack of respect, and others who are total poopoo heads whose behavior brands them as dullards and miscreants. This time I won't make the mistake of calling them by name. You will know them easily enough by their actions.

[abaris]

I think, you have to make a distinction here. If his Majesty were to serve me a burger I would respect him as a human being trying to scrape by. If he were to preach to me in real life, I would have a hard time not to succumb to the flght or flight impulse.

When he posts here on the other hand, I haven't got the least bit of respect for the person behind the nick. I respect fr0d0 though. Not because of his religious views, but for his political stance. That goes to show, things aren't seldomly black and white.

Luckily I find myself in the position, that I haven't to deal with persos preaching in real life. In my parts, preaching isn't offered when not asked for.

[GrandizerII]

It might also depend on the nature of online interactions. In the past, I would easily find myself more aggressive online than in person with regards to theists (even when they share the same beliefs basically). And that could be because it seems easier for me to depersonalize them when I can't really see the person behind the screen but just their words.

Nowadays I try my best to stay calm when debating theists online and remind myself to treat them the same way I would treat my theistic friends and relatives in person. Kindness and respect.

[fr0d0]

I've noticed that about you too W. You were far more tolerant not very long ago. Not that I blame you or would question why. You're a reasonable person in my book and I respect you for your long held tolerance. I'm sorry for my own whining. I annoy myself with that too lol Dammit. Haha

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

I find that I don't respect people on the basis of their theism or lack thereof. Quite frankly, it is far, FAR more important to me how people behave that how they believe.

Boru

[fr0d0]

[Minimalist]

I agree with Frods.

And, I have noted that people who believe in shit usually behave like shit.

[Jenny A]

I've been noticing myself becoming less and less respectful toward theists as I spend more and more time here at AF.org. At first I thought that might be about me. But now I think it is about the theists. Tolerance and manners is a question of personal policy and conditioning/upbringing. But doling out respect is not.

Welcome to the club. I think for me the difference here is twofold. First, I don't usually plumb the depths of why theist believe what they believe, so I just ignore the whole belief issue most of the time. This is one of those cases where knowing more doesn't necessarily lead to better understanding. Second, respect is generally, as you say good manners. And I feel that theists here deserve good manners to the same extent that evangelists at the doorstep do, which is to say not nearly so much as the same person met under other circumstances.

Respect isn't entirely rational. I don't consciously set the parameters of what I find praiseworthy. Rather, I notice what wins my respect, what doesn't and what elicits the opposite reaction.

What I've noticed about me, is that it isn't god belief per se which loses my respect but rather the way in which that belief is held. I'm not arguing for what is in fact most respectable, only sharing what I find to be so.

I would agree. Theists who understand that faith is not rational and is a choice to believe without evidence elicit more respect in me than theists who insist that their belief is rational. I find I have little patience for those who think the Bible is factually inerrant.

I also have empathy for the struggle of other theists here.

Again, I agree is only because I know what it is to hold a minority position. But, I find more and more my empathy is tempered by the knowledge that the theist here choose to be here in a way that I don't choose to be bombarded with religiosity.

However, I do tend to wince at the way some of us respond to theists.

[abaris]

However, I do tend to wince at the way some of us respond to theists.

Yeah, maybe so.

But maybe that's rather because ignorance is so rampant among some of the theists. They readily ignore scientific evidence, refuse to read links presented to them and only keep thumping the bible.

I'm sorry, if someone takes Adam and Eve or the Great Flood literally, it goes beyond of what I can stomach.

[dyresand]

It all depends on the person because when it comes down to it in a world view way per say.
you have people who are theists they can be the nicest people very but when you say you do not believe they loose all respect for a person who disagrees with their faith.
When it comes down to it its just ignorance for the most part people have to worry about. you just cant go into a argument and preach to people that x is right y is wrong because
product a is right. i talk to theists i want to hear them and their beliefs but i am skeptical and i am sure there is no god. but i give them enough time to explain it to me the best way
i can understand and accept it. After awhile i learned they have same arguments for the most part i give them some respect but not all of it.