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RE: need to vent
December 1, 2014 at 5:50 pm
(This post was last modified: December 1, 2014 at 6:01 pm by watchamadoodle.)
(December 1, 2014 at 5:00 pm)Exian Wrote: Not to scare you off your path or anything, but searching for evidence has made many an atheist.
When you start reading the bible and make an attempt to corroborate what you read with reality, history, the beginnings of writing, the origin of humans, the origin of life, the origin of Earth, the origin of the universe, and the ideas and morphology of gods, you'll start chipping away at Christianity. Often the bible IS falsifiable. Until you're left with just God; the guy whose entire existence hinges on the Bible's veracity.
I found that doubting and proving false the bible was much easier than letting go of my personal relationship with God. Still, it fell like dominos once I realized God wasn't a meta-man in Heaven/everywhere, but a theory of mind that existed in its entirety and uniqueness in my head alone.
The nice thing about being on this side of theism is blasphemy has no meaning! 
So, welcome Watchamadoodle. I implore you to blaspheme away!
Thanks. It does seem to be difficult and slow for me. I have been reading about the history of Judaism to convince myself that it evolved gradually from Canaanite religions. That has been helpful.
My only concern is that a God of some kind might be working through the world's false religions. I was mildly psychotic for a while, so I have some very strange memories that bother me periodically. I'm getting there slowly. (Metaphysical naturalism is much healthier for me psychologically due to the psychotic issues. Sometimes I can become suspicious that something outside reality is trying to communicate with me - typical psychosis stuff. I can't afford to be too open-minded because my brain keeps falling out.)
(December 1, 2014 at 5:02 pm)Losty Wrote: (December 1, 2014 at 4:27 pm)watchamadoodle Wrote: Hi, Lemonvariable72. Your avatar suggests that you are a Christian. If that is the case, what do you think about the Christian forum accusing me of blasphemy and flaming for explaining that I thought Christianity and Judaism were both false based on historical evidence? How is that blasphemy? Surely every Christian is aware that some people don't believe. That shouldn't offend them IMO.
Lemon isn't a Christian hehe. I will say that even if it doesn't offend them, it's still blasphemy. As far as I know blasphemy is any written or oral reproach of god.
Oops, I was fooled by the cross. Now I feel like a cotton headed ninny muggins for sure.
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RE: need to vent
December 1, 2014 at 6:03 pm
(This post was last modified: December 1, 2014 at 6:05 pm by Exian.)
Ever hear of The Armoured Skeptic on youtube? One of his early videos follows your story pretty closely (from what I remember). The elements of paranoia, uncertainty, and psychosis bear resemblance.
I'll post it for you. Spoiler: it's a success story.
[youtube]zWuWRsayzCY[/youtube]
I can't remember where this verse is from, I think it got removed from canon:
"I don't hang around with mostly men because I'm gay. It's because men are better than women. Better trained, better equipped...better. Just better! I'm not gay."
For context, this is the previous verse:
"Hi Jesus" -robvalue
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RE: need to vent
December 1, 2014 at 6:06 pm
A belated hi from me too. And no, I'm not a xtian either despite what the handsome dude in my avatar says.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: need to vent
December 1, 2014 at 6:48 pm
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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RE: need to vent
December 1, 2014 at 11:18 pm
(December 1, 2014 at 6:03 pm)Exian Wrote: Ever hear of The Armoured Skeptic on youtube? One of his early videos follows your story pretty closely (from what I remember). The elements of paranoia, uncertainty, and psychosis bear resemblance.
I'll post it for you. Spoiler: it's a success story.
Thanks, that was an interesting story. There are some similarities. I am an introverted loner, so my response to mental illness was different. I wanted to join a monastery so I could escape from the world. I remember reading the Garden of Eden story in Genesis and thinking that I had discovered profound secret meanings. I suppose it would be like smoking marijuana and then reading the Bible. That's probably the only way it makes sense.
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RE: need to vent
December 2, 2014 at 12:42 am
(This post was last modified: December 2, 2014 at 12:43 am by Whateverist.)
(December 1, 2014 at 1:53 pm)watchamadoodle Wrote: (December 1, 2014 at 12:12 pm)Tonus Wrote: Am I the only one who read the "not" in that sentence?
Thanks for highlighting the "no", Tonus.
I should have said "I ain't no rational, intellectual atheist". Then there would have been less chance for confusion.
No need to reach for a 25¢'er like "ain't" when "not" works just as well with out puttin' on aires.
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RE: need to vent
December 2, 2014 at 12:53 am
Quote:Hi, I was just scolded for blasphemy and flaming at a Christian forum even though I was being sincere and respectful.
 to AF, but may I ask which forum this was on? And also what were your questions?
(December 1, 2014 at 10:53 am)Bad Wolf Wrote: Ugh.... describing yourself as an 'intellectual' makes you sound like a jerk Um no, he said that he's not an intellectual.
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50. -LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea. -LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
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RE: need to vent
December 2, 2014 at 1:48 am
(December 1, 2014 at 4:27 pm)watchamadoodle Wrote: (December 1, 2014 at 2:04 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: LOL! Totally misread it!
No problemo. I'm glad the confusion is cleared-up, because people would think I am pretty silly for claiming to be an intellectual when I'm obviously not. I try my best not to sound like a cotton headed ninny muggins, but I'm not always successful.
(December 1, 2014 at 1:31 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: You sound like someone who can offer perspective. I think you will be great here.
Hi, Lemonvariable72. Your avatar suggests that you are a Christian. If that is the case, what do you think about the Christian forum accusing me of blasphemy and flaming for explaining that I thought Christianity and Judaism were both false based on historical evidence? How is that blasphemy? Surely every Christian is aware that some people don't believe. That shouldn't offend them IMO.
I think I need to look at my avatar again. I have not been a christer in almost two years, in fact last thread was arguing that we should throw the Bible altogether when it comes to ancient history.
Now to answer your question. First I want to address is that the term used in the bible is "blaspheme the holy spirit". Now that is as vague as fuck, but the way most see that is basically apostasy, but others see it as rejecting christianity, and still take it ad pretty much anything negetive said about christianity. The reason Christians sometimes take such knee jerk reactions is because these questions challenge them and make it hard for them not to change the beliefs they are comfortable with.
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
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RE: need to vent
December 2, 2014 at 3:48 am
Hiya watch, welcome!
Sadly one of the ways religion survives is by silencing those who would ask questions. And threatening them with hell. Any honest institution would have no need to act this way.
I'm glad you came to our forum, you won't get any of that kind of nonsense here (from the atheists anyway).
Asking questions is both natural and important. I like the way you describe your journey, I think it represents well the general experience of life.
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RE: need to vent
December 2, 2014 at 8:57 am
(This post was last modified: December 2, 2014 at 9:11 am by watchamadoodle.)
(December 2, 2014 at 12:53 am)Aractus Wrote: Quote:Hi, I was just scolded for blasphemy and flaming at a Christian forum even though I was being sincere and respectful.
to AF, but may I ask which forum this was on? And also what were your questions?
It was "Christian Forums" ( http://www.christianforums.com). I created the question in their "Exploring Christianity" sub forum which is where non-Christians can ask questions. My blasphemous topic has been totally erased, so I can't quote it exactly.
The title was "Is Christianity a Mask for Something Else?". I explained that I am convinced from reading history that Christianity and Judaism are both false. Then I explained that I have experienced weird things throughout my life that make it seem like Christianity might be true. Then I presented a possible solution - that something is communicating with people through the concepts embedded in their subconscious mind from childhood (Christianity for people in Christian cultures, Hinduism for people in Hindu cultures, etc.).
So my real question was if there are Christians who don't actually believe in Christianity but see it as a useful toolkit to communicate with whatever God or force really exists. In other words, Christians should practice Christianity even though it isn't true, because it is embedded in their psychology and provides the strongest psychological levers.
It was an honest question, and I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. So it made me angry to be accused of blasphemy and flaming.
(Of course hallucinations and delusions are another explanation for my religious experiences. Sometimes I can accept the psychological explanation and sometimes I'm not convinced. Gradually I've become more convinced, but it has been slow.)
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