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God is a Terrorist.
#21
RE: God is a Terrorist.
Assumption number one. What makes God worthy? Because he says so? Because he can kick our ass?
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#22
RE: God is a Terrorist.
(April 6, 2015 at 2:07 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Creating us already in heaven seems pretty graceful to me.
How would heaven be. Describe it. What is the purpose of heaven.
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#23
RE: God is a Terrorist.
(April 6, 2015 at 2:08 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:
(April 6, 2015 at 2:07 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Creating us already in heaven seems pretty graceful to me.
How would heaven be. Describe it. What is the purpose of heaven.

Heaven is god's carrot to hell's stick.
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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#24
RE: God is a Terrorist.
Beats me, you're the one who claims to know all this 'purpose' stuff.
In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
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#25
RE: God is a Terrorist.
Let's have a honest intellectual discussion. I think I can show you why it's a weak argument.

I can write it all up, but I think it's better if we discuss each premise, instead of people then saying "all assumptions, nothing proven".

(April 6, 2015 at 2:11 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Beats me, you're the one who claims to know all this 'purpose' stuff.
Well you stated you think creating us in heaven would be the most worthy grace if God is the most worthy goal.

Stating heaven without description of it, makes no sense. That's just a word. So what do you think heaven is.
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#26
RE: God is a Terrorist.
(April 6, 2015 at 2:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Let's have a honest intellectual discussion. I think I can show you why it's a weak argument.

I can write it all up, but I think it's better if we discuss each premise, instead of people then saying "all assumptions, nothing proven".

You can have another turn.

(Roll for initiative?)
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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#27
RE: God is a Terrorist.
I think the best thing to do is, if he created us with the ability to think on our own, not punishing us for doing just that. Assuming he is the one who gave us free will, which it seems he either didn't, or doesn't understand how free will works. We have the ability to disagree, and come up with ideas of our own, btu using that ability in any way is considered sin. Even if we disagree on things like equality.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."

10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/

Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50

A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html

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#28
RE: God is a Terrorist.
Well first, I think good actions create realities. Higher realities, both in the soul and how can God be experienced. I don't think God can bestow higher ranks without freewill and praiseworthy action.

Love has a hidden wisdom. When tried with veils, trials, tribulations, and it's patience is "to God do we belong" and it's tranquility "and to whom do we return", the blessings of God descend from a higher realm, created, that cannot be otherwise created.

Trying us by evil, and by wanting to battle against the evil ourselves, and the hidden evil forces, and rejecting them and cling to his light, his handhold, bestows a special honor.

The Divine sword of God in the trial can bestow high honor and bring one to ranks otherwise and stations and inherit beauty and glory that cannot be inherited without such a trial.

Now I believe none of us should be put into this trial, unless, we wanted it, and this what Quran says, that the human chose the trust while the heavens and the earth where to scared to carry it.

But we chose it because we loved God, and this was a trial before coming to this world.

That said, in the design, God is going to try us by good and evil, blessings and afflictions.

The blessings that come from afflictions are unique, Imam Jaffar is quoted to have said is misbahal shariah:

Affliction is an adornment for the believer and a mark of honour for the man of intellect, because facing it directly needs steadfastness and firm-footedness, both of which confirm belief. The Holy Prophet said, 'We, the company of the prophets, are the people who have the hardest trials, then after us come the believers, then the others like them.'

Whoever tastes the food of affliction while under Allah's protection enjoys it more than he enjoys Allah's blessing. He yearns for it when it is not there, because the lights of blessing lie under the balance of affliction and trial, and the balance of affliction and trial lies under the lights of blessing. Many are delivered from affliction and then destroyed in blessing. Allah praised none of His bondsmen, from Adam up to Muhammad, until He had tested him and seen how he fulfilled the duty of worship while in affliction. Allah's marks of honour come, in fact, at the last stage, but the afflictions themselves come in the beginning.

Whoever leaves the path of affliction is ignoring the lamp of the believers, the beacon of those near to Allah, and the guide for those on the right path. There is no good in a slave who complains of a single trial preceded by thousands of blessings and followed by thousands of comforts. Whoever does not show the patience required in affliction is deprived of thankfulness in the blessings he receives. Similarly, whoever does not give the thankfulness owed for blessings is denied the patience owed in affliction. Whoever is denied both of them is an outcast.

Ayyub said in his supplication, 'O Allah, verily seventy comforts and ease did not come to me until You sent me seventy afflictions.'

And Wahb ibn Munabbih said, 'Affliction to a believer is like a bit to a horse and a halter to a camel.' Ali said, 'Steadfastness in relation to belief is like the head to the body. The head of steadfastness is afflictions but only those who act righteously understand that.'


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God designs the universe in a way that tries us. As the creator with ultimate wisdom, and because we belong to him, he can try us because his will is benevolent.

No one else has the right to try people by evil, because this is a rank that belongs to God and belongs to him because he is the ruler of the system, which has an over all good purpose.

When God punishes nations and destroys them, it occurs with his knowledge that they were doing mischief in the land, oppressing others, and he comes to warn them to halt that behaviour. When the clear proofs come, miracles, clear wisdom, clear message, and they still deny....then God has the right to punish them for their injustice and rid the world of their evil.

He isn't wronging anyone.

However what the Bible states the Israel did to the Phalestines is not something that God would allow, for humans are not allowed to do such things and declare they are bringing judgement of God.

God being the designer, and has a benevolent will in bringing the most worthwhile purpose, can try us by evil. No creation is however allowed to try another creation by evil and God's will is to entrust humanity with the struggle through his help to establish justice, peace, goodness, and mercy.

By the struggle for good against evil, the struggle against corruption, and the striving in God's path, we can earn ranks that make us closer to God, and inherit praise that belongs to God otherwise we can't.

So you can say God is a terrorist for creating life and death or for destroying oppressive nations, but it is baseless, and is because you think the rank and rights of God as the same as humans and thinking the designer and creator is bound in the same way we are bound, but we aren't allowed to try people because we don't have the exalted wisdom and high rank of God and because we don't own creation.

We show patience to his trial because we belong to God and his high rank, thereby receiving blessings from this honoring of God, but how can a creation be shown this patience when it doesn't own us, when showing patience to it doesn't raise us rank as it's pleasure is not our goal.

So this is the wisdom of "Give news to the patience,. Tose who an affliction occur to them say God do we belong, and to him do we return". These are whom God's blessings are upon..." (Suratal Baqara, 2nd chapter of Quran).

(April 6, 2015 at 2:24 pm)Chad32 Wrote: I think the best thing to do is, if he created us with the ability to think on our own, not punishing us for doing just that. Assuming he is the one who gave us free will, which it seems he either didn't, or doesn't understand how free will works. We have the ability to disagree, and come up with ideas of our own, btu using that ability in any way is considered sin. Even if we disagree on things like equality.

I don't think God punishes us for wrong thinking, but it's rather when the truth becomes manifest, and the falsehood of Satanic and evil forces defeated, if we prefer the falsehood then and follow it, we hate the truth and God's pleasure, which is hate of his light, and we neglect his favor and path, becoming ungrateful and stubborn.

I'm not saying this is true of you guys. But it is something to take caution regard. 

The world is designed so we can attain the honor of the following verse:

يَا أَيُّهَا الْإِنْسَانُ إِنَّكَ كَادِحٌ إِلَىٰ رَبِّكَ كَدْحًا فَمُلَاقِيهِ
 
O human, you are to strive to your Lord a striving so that you meet him.
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#29
RE: God is a Terrorist.
...so it's all a test?

what
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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#30
RE: God is a Terrorist.
And to add, this meeting of God is even beyond Gabriel who is an instance of the holy spirit, telling Mohammad he cannot step further for he will burn.

(April 6, 2015 at 2:54 pm)Spooky Wrote: ...so it's all a test?

what

Yes he created the test so that he can bestow his grace through patience, striving hard, humbleness, and tranquility. 

And so that his friends can battle for good and that God may help who helps him, thereby purifying them and completing his favor upon them.
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