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Pascal's Wager Revisited
#1
Pascal's Wager Revisited
Often in our lives we "evenly rotate," mindlessly taking unto ourselves the monotonous drudgery of "what is." We are slaves to the "what is." Why do you work? So you can eat. Why do you eat? So you can work. It's wake up, go to work, come home, sleep, ...

Yet sometimes we or others create something new and beautiful that has not yet been experienced and enjoyed. This beauty is a transcendence of what is and thankfully, especially under capitalism, it happens many times for each person every day. For example, we constantly encounter new and wonderful products created by entrepreneurs and put on the market. One learns something new, or he sees a new work of art, or he increases in virtue. The fact of endless improvement, such as economic progress, is inherent in all human affairs. There is perpetual transcendence of the boring status quo into something novel, interesting, zesty, and as yet untasted. Every day we are jarred out of our complacent even rotation.

Now we come upon death. It seems like an ultimate "what is," an ultimate constraint. On the one hand, there is a clear realization that with all our power and technology, we are unable to avoid death. Even the universe will die, too. On the other hand, the reality of never-ending self- and world-improvement, both for humanity and the individual, suggests that perhaps there is something that can help us overcome death. This is an intuition, a hope, a glimmer of light in the darkness.

But how shall man overcome death? At the very least, by soul-making himself during this life into the kind of person for whom eternal life will be a joy and not at all a burden.

Attend that there are three realities in this life: of combat, of victory, and of defeat. We humans, both as a race and as individuals have surmounted and overcome numerous obstacles and constraints. But we also failed many times. Thus, it seems that some people live such unhappy lives that they would be absolutely devastated if their eternal lives were even somewhat close to the lives they live here. Suppose that if they choose to die, their souls are annihilated, and they disappear into nothingness.

We extrapolate that some people fail at overcoming death, and other people succeed. Those who fail at becoming the sort of people who will always enjoy eternal life succeed, and those who choose death evaporate, and that's that. For example, being morally good is crucial for happiness, and perhaps the environment one will inhabit in the next life will be a reflection of his inner virtues. Or, if one has crafted himself into a steadfast seeker of his happiness in his life, he will find it in the next. If the next life is worse than this life, then any steps I take to prepare myself for it will be in vain. There is no way I'll voluntarily suffer an eternity of misery. I will end up desiring to die in that next life, and the problems are again upon us.

The unseen and unknown X that helps us to overcome death is called God.

This God must be judged as extremely creative of a considerable and in fact infinite amount of good.

We honor our human creative geniuses, such as by giving them Nobel prizes; why also not honor whatever it is that helps us transcend death, in doing so showing itself to be extremely creative, as well as perhaps benevolent (as in willing good to us), powerful to accomplish a feat like this, intelligent as in knowing how to preserve souls from corrupting, etc.?

Indeed, these are inchoate feelings, signs and portents, pagan dreams. But they may be enough.

Now let's call Shatheism or Sha the doctrine that there is no eternal life after death, and Shbelief or Shb, that there is. If one is unsure whether to pick Sha and Shb, one should consider that if Sha is true, he loses little in preparing himself for "heaven" (at the most, since under Sha, a good man becomes equal to an evil man and to zero in death, he may lose some ephemeral advantages of being evil); if Shb is true, his preparations will ensure that he will enjoy himself to the fullest in that next life. It seems that betting on Shb makes sense.
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#2
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
You...really wrote all that to toss Pascal's Wager at us? You don't think this idea has been done to death? It's utterly unconvincing and dishonest to both oneself and any god one is ostensibly trying to worship.
In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
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#3
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
(April 7, 2015 at 2:34 pm)dat Wrote: The unseen and unknown X that helps us to overcome death is called God.

This God must be judged as extremely creative of a considerable and in fact infinite amount of good.

Citations needed.
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#4
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
Only one problem with this.  You haven't proved that there's eternal life after death.

Also, how do you know for the certain that the Catholic concept of God is correct?  What if God is really like the Hindu Brahman?
Badger Badger Badger Badger Where are the snake and mushroom smilies?
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#5
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
The only thing ever really new to me with theists making arguments is how they try to redress the same old skunk up in what they think is a tuxedo of words.
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#6
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
Why did God create the concept of death?
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#7
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
Well, he says it's "revisited," so he at least knows we've visited it.

Looks like all the revisitation did is a lot of "seems" and "supposes" and "musts" and "mays" and equivocations and such.
How will we know, when the morning comes, we are still human? - 2D

Don't worry, my friend.  If this be the end, then so shall it be.
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#8
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
Okay, I want to believe that death isn't the end. I don't want to live forever, necessarily, as that's well, a frickin' long time, and you know what they say, "Be careful what you wish for," but I want to live for more than a century at most. So, I didn't see that option between Sha or Shb. Is there a Shc I can tell myself that I believe in (even though I really don't)?
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
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#9
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
(April 7, 2015 at 2:34 pm)datc Wrote: Now let's call Shatheism or Sha the doctrine that there is no eternal life after death, and Shbelief or Shb, that there is.

Except there's more than just those two choices, isn't there? Pascal's Wager functions by lying and pretending there's only two, but that isn't true because all of those "Shbeliefs" take great pains to be mutually exclusive; if you pick one, you're going to hell in all the others and vice versa. If I believe in Catholicism and Islam turns out to be true, then I lose exactly the same as an atheist would. And hell, since we're discussing unverified beliefs completely divorced from everything we know about reality we also aren't justified in merely considering existing religions either; all the dead religions come back into play, and in fact an infinity of minutely different belief systems, all with the same eternal punishment, become equally as likely as whatever the hell you believe. You have absolutely no justification for presupposing that the only belief system worthy of going into this equation is your own, and the moment we begin to consider Pascal's Wager fairly, it falls apart, as every risk is exactly equal no matter what we pick.


Quote:If one is unsure whether to pick Sha and Shb, one should consider that if Sha is true, he loses little in preparing himself for "heaven" (at the most, since under Sha, a good man becomes equal to an evil man and to zero in death, he may lose some ephemeral advantages of being evil)

Yeah, unlike you, I don't behave morally because I think there's some heavenly reward in it for me, I do it because it's the right thing to do, so I don't have the same gnawing worry that you seem to have, that I may have wasted my opportunity to be a bad person. I'm not chomping at the bit to be one in the first place, unlike seemingly every christian who phrases "not being a completely immoral asshole" as a bad thing they're disappointed for not getting. Dodgy
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee

Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
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#10
RE: Pascal's Wager Revisited
Oh, great. You do realise that catholicism is only one of the 41,000 denominations of christianity and christianity is only one of 20 major religious groups (the smallest of which having approx. 600,000 members) in existence today? They can't all be right, but they can all be wrong.

Also, what does that say about the sincerity of your beliefs if you only preserve them because it might benefit you after you die? I'm sure Jesus approves of your calculating dishonesty.
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