I'm Swiss

[Daystar]

I just now watched Bill Maher's I'm Swiss (From March 2005) and was surprised to find that I agreed with most of what he said. Though I am apolitical as much as I am irreligious I think that the movie sort of made me realize even more than I was currently leaning that the issue isn't so much about religion or politics. It is more about the stupid lazy sort of apathetic nature of people in general. I am more excited now to see Religulous and wonder if I will agree with that or not.

[bozo]

I just now watched Bill Maher's I'm Swiss (From March 2005) and was surprised to find that I agreed with most of what he said. Though I am apolitical as much as I am irreligious I think that the movie sort of made me realize even more than I was currently leaning that the issue isn't so much about religion or politics. It is more about the stupid lazy sort of apathetic nature of people in general. I am more excited now to see Religulous and wonder if I will agree with that or not.

Daystar, just SOMETIMES I can agree with you....your description of the nature of people in general is such an instance.

[Edwardo Piet]

I am not mostly against religious belief itself. I'm more against "Faith" as a whole. So that includes pseudoscience, anything supernatural and anything superstitious. I am against anything that I believe is delusional.
That's on the truth.
On morality the specific kind of "Faith" or superstition I am against is dogma. I am against anything "taught" as a dogma - or rather anything preached, dictated, demanded, proclaimed, etc as a dogma. That's what dogma really does. Dogma doesn't really teach anything but give an example of why you should not be dogmatic.

[lukec]

Hey, I forgot to tell everyone, I saw Religulous! It was good, more or less exactly what I was expecting, and I have to see it again. It really drove home for me how much damage religion can do, and how truly crazy some religious people are.

[Daystar]

I am not mostly against religious belief itself. I'm more against "Faith" as a whole. So that includes pseudoscience, anything supernatural and anything superstitious. I am against anything that I believe is delusional.

I'm glad you brought that up. I have never been superstitious but just the other day I realized that everyone I have ever know (all atheists) were superstitious. I thought that was odd.

For the morality part the specific kind of "Faith" or superstition I am against is dogma. I am against anything "taught" as a dogma. Or rather anything preached, dictated, demanded, proclaimed, etc as a dogma.

That reminds me of the portion of Maher's movie where he talked about opinions and how they shouldn't be law. I see dogma as an arrogant assertion of opinion, but the thing that bothers me even more is propaganda.

[Edwardo Piet]

I'm glad you brought that up. I have never been superstitious but just the other day I realized that everyone I have ever know (all atheists) were superstitious. I thought that was odd.

Well I think you are definitely superstitious. You believe in the supernatural. Thats a huge superstition. Its just a very common one. Whatever that supernatural belief may be. I believe anything supernatural is superstition.
Belief in a "God" or anything supernatural is superstition.

That reminds me of the portion of Maher's movie where he talked about opinions and how they shouldn't be law. I see dogma as an arrogant assertion of opinion, but the thing that bothers me even more is propaganda.

Yeah I'd say that propaganda is a kind of dogma though right? Its a certain way of "teaching" a dogma. Or is it the other way around? Or don't you think they are connected at all?

[Daystar]

Well I think you are definitely superstitious. You believe in the supernatural. Thats a huge superstition. Its just a very common one. Whatever that supernatural belief may be. I believe anything supernatural is superstition.
Belief in a "God" or anything supernatural is superstition.

By definition anyone who believes in God, which is supernatural - that is being outside of the known science is superstitious, but I trust God more than I do science. To me superstitious is fear based upon ignorance. That I don't have and was surprised to learn that many atheists do.

Yeah I'd say that propaganda is a kind of dogma though right? Its a certain way of "teaching" a dogma. Or is it the other way around? Or don't you think they are connected at all?

I think that they are very similar but dogma, at least to me, has a more arrogance. The Church in the dark ages and Evolution in more modern times. Propaganda has a more obvious agenda whereas dogma is presumptuous.

[Tiberius]

To me superstitious is fear based upon ignorance. That I don't have and was surprised to learn that many atheists do.

Could you explain what "fear" atheists have that is based on ignorance?

[Edwardo Piet]

I know how certainly at least a LOT of believers do. They "believe" in God because they fear him and hell and/or want a reward in heaven. The whole Pascal's Wager thing is a thing entirely based on risk/reward. Placing a bet so that one will go to heaven rather than hell. Totally based on fear and/or desire to go to heaven.
Pure ignorance based on fear and/or selfish desire. Or selfless desire perhaps if they actually try to get their family, friends and others to make the same wager.
Extreme ignorance at its highest level. Based on fear, desire or - usually - both.
"If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. " - Albert Einstein.
I agree with Einstein's opinion.

[Daystar]

To me superstitious is fear based upon ignorance. That I don't have and was surprised to learn that many atheists do.

Could you explain what "fear" atheists have that is based on ignorance?

I'm not talking about a fear in atheists in general, I'm just saying that all of the atheists I know seem to have superstitions like not opening an umberella indoors or good luck shirts things of that nature. Friday the 13th etc.