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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 11:29 am
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 3:36 pm
There are two states, "going to hell" and "not going to hell."
The " I don't know and my completely non-official interpretation is that we won't comment on our revelations of god's word anymore" is very dishonest when all of the Bible verses, and official catholic doctrine pieces that can be readily researched, either very strongly supports that atheists are going to hell by the revealed word to the catholic church or with enough weaseling weakly states that the question isn't answered." There is no catholic theology that supports an atheist in heaven or contradicts one in hell.
Weasel, squirm, and stretch all you want.
If catholic priests have used the threat of hell in their sermons in the past, they have declared it the word of god, they never hedge it by saying "just maybe , but we don't know."
If god gives atheists a choice to be left alone in an afterlife and not having to spend eternity groveling at someone's feet, pretty much everyone would take that option.
Find the cure for Fundementia!
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 3:49 pm
(August 9, 2015 at 3:36 pm)Brakeman Wrote: There are two states, "going to hell" and "not going to hell."
The " I don't know and my completely non-official interpretation is that we won't comment on our revelations of god's word anymore" is very dishonest when all of the Bible verses, and official catholic doctrine pieces that can be readily researched, either very strongly supports that atheists are going to hell by the revealed word to the catholic church or with enough weaseling weakly states that the question isn't answered." There is no catholic theology that supports an atheist in heaven or contradicts one in hell.
Weasel, squirm, and stretch all you want.
If catholic priests have used the threat of hell in their sermons in the past, they have declared it the word of god, they never hedge it by saying "just maybe , but we don't know."
If god gives atheists a choice to be left alone in an afterlife and not having to spend eternity groveling at someone's feet, pretty much everyone would take that option.
Can you point to where Catholic teaching states that all atheists automatically go to Hell simply for being atheist?
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 4:12 pm
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2015 at 4:14 pm by TubbyTubby.)
I'm no expert, just a quick search..
The Vatican has quickly clarified that atheists - they believe - are still going to hell, despite Pope Francis appearing to say non-believers could be saved through Christ if they do good.
Vatican spokesman Rev. Thomas Rosica said people who know about the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter her or remain in her.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/...34479.html
Although the alternative view is..
"Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists," reported the Huffington Post.
"Pope Francis suggests atheists' good deeds get them to heaven," said the headline in Cheryl K. Chumley's piece in the Washington Times. Reportedly, the Pope confirmed that "atheists can indeed go to heaven," and this is as a result of "good deeds."
http://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/st...p?id=51106
Seems the pope fella can't make his mind up although they do shift their stance more and more recently - unfortunately not about anything that might make a fucking difference.
How can anyone not see the irony in saying "atheists can indeed go to heaven" baffles me. Who is the intended audience?
No idea about atheists and hell in scripture mind, I don't read that shit.
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 4:43 pm
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2015 at 4:44 pm by Longhorn.)
Geeesh. I think I like muslims more. At least they keep a unified front. Unbeliever? Hell. much less complicated 
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 5:07 pm
(August 9, 2015 at 4:12 pm)TubbyTubby Wrote: I'm no expert, just a quick search..
The Vatican has quickly clarified that atheists - they believe - are still going to hell, despite Pope Francis appearing to say non-believers could be saved through Christ if they do good.
Vatican spokesman Rev. Thomas Rosica said people who know about the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter her or remain in her.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/...34479.html
Although the alternative view is..
"Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists," reported the Huffington Post.
"Pope Francis suggests atheists' good deeds get them to heaven," said the headline in Cheryl K. Chumley's piece in the Washington Times. Reportedly, the Pope confirmed that "atheists can indeed go to heaven," and this is as a result of "good deeds."
http://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/st...p?id=51106
Seems the pope fella can't make his mind up although they do shift their stance more and more recently - unfortunately not about anything that might make a fucking difference.
How can anyone not see the irony in saying "atheists can indeed go to heaven" baffles me. Who is the intended audience?
No idea about atheists and hell in scripture mind, I don't read that shit.
The first site doesn't know anything about Catholicism, as is very common for these news media sites. Completely useless form of information on anything to do with the Church. The second site is a Catholic giving their opinion, which they are entitled to. But you will not find any Catholic teaching that states that all atheists will automatically go to hell for being atheist.
If you have any doubts on this, I found this question being asked on a Catholic forum. I know that particular forum has mostly very uber conservative, by the book type people, where people take the more conservative side to anything. Yet even there, no such teaching is presented, and the general consensus is "I don't know" :
http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=213781
As for this sentence: "How can anyone not see the irony in saying "atheists can indeed go to heaven" baffles me. Who is the intended audience?" Lol, apparently a lot of people here seem to care since it comes up quite a bit and we are both posting on a thread titled "Am I going to Hell" 
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 5:09 pm
(August 9, 2015 at 4:43 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: Geeesh. I think I like muslims more. At least they keep a unified front. Unbeliever? Hell. much less complicated
The reason Catholics disagree on this issue is precisely because the Church holds no teaching on it. As I said in my first post.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 5:20 pm
Yep, like I said. At least muslims can get their story straight 
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 5:34 pm
(August 9, 2015 at 5:20 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: Yep, like I said. At least muslims can get their story straight
Well I guess they're just better then.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Am I Going To Hell?
August 9, 2015 at 5:39 pm
(This post was last modified: August 9, 2015 at 5:44 pm by Longhorn.)
Eeeyup, pretty much. That and arab guys are hot
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