Evidence for God being "a superior being" ?

[Minimalist]

I do not worship a belief I worship the One I believe in period.

If only he existed you'd be golden.

[Welsh cake]

1- The conditions aren't imposed on the part of the creator, they're due to the reciprocal dynamic of exchanging love. If my time here proves anything it's that love can be accepted or rejected, and reciprocated love still feels like love from the giving side, but not from the receiving side. I still say the unconditional part stands.

If you're going to undertake the pointless task of redefining the already defined concept of emotional love at least make it meaningful. And I still say the 'unconditional' part is fucking absurd and leaves us open to every conceivable form of abuse imaginable.

2- I agree on your point of your perception of the Biblical character of God, that's not love, that's manipulation, personification and misconception.

This is so bloody tedious. Let's make this interesting, I'm issuing you a challenge tack: quote one line just ONE event in the Bible where you disagree completely with your God concept's reckless actions, I dare you to cite one time where you found his character to be utterly immoral, repugnant and reprehensible. If you can successfully pull that (feat) off then just for you I'll quote a single passage from Biblical text where I find your tyrant godfather concept's decision(s)/action(s) to be benign and morally positive.

3- Anything worth having is worth sacrificing for. God does forgive everyone, what about that aren't you getting. He sacrificed for sinners and saints alike. His sacrifice wasn't just his death on the cross that was just the end of it. If you can't see the nobility of self-sacrifice through literally dying to give everyone a chance at eternal happiness, I don't think I can make you see anything different. IMO it seems like you're intentionally wearing blinders though.

I don't want eternal existence with your imaginery deity. Does your depraved god concept respect my heart-felt decision? Fuck no, according to you its fire and brimstone for me, hooray!

The nature of people who reject the holy God is such that they deserve to burn in hell forever and ever. These are the sorts of people who would harm undeserving others without a second thought (if they had the opportunity (e.g. no punishments from authorities)).

Wow. I'm sorry to hear that your religion has so polluted your mind that you're unable to comprehend what is immoral about what you're saying. Your God-belief has no right to condemn anyone to eternal suffering for finite crimes.

You call yourself an atheist, but would you really reject THE embodiment of morality, justice, fair treatment, and so on - when you saw it (i.e. is it a lack of evidence, or is it a matter of hatred)?

I'M the embodiment and author of MY morality, not your Hebrew tribal sky daddy.

I am a Christian and I don't believe that Jesus "paid God for my sins".

Who else was this atonement for then?

I do not worship a belief I worship the One I believe in period.

http://ironwolf.dangerousgames.com/blog/archives/346

[Ace Otana]

The nature of people who reject the holy God is such that they deserve to burn in hell forever and ever. These are the sorts of people who would harm undeserving others without a second thought (if they had the opportunity (e.g. no punishments from authorities)).

How is that rational, moral, decent or intelligent? That is just sick.
If god really does send people to hell for such pathetic reasons, then I want nothing to do with this total dick. He can't be all-loving, nor all intelligent and so he can't be perfect. So if he's not perfect, then he must have flaws. So why call him god?

Also, how does someone's lack of belief bring harm on others? Who has been affected/harmed by lack of belief? If lack of belief brings no harm to anyone, then why would the person who lacks belief deserve an eternity of punishment? It is without reason and so is without intelligance. Rules made without reason, are rules made without sense.

I wish to add that as an atheist, I don't reject god, I reject the claim that he exists. Big differance. However, if such a god is as dumb as the one you discribe. Then I would want nothing to do with such a total immoral shit head. Respect goes both ways, and I cannot respect a being who can't respect others.

It's your beliefs, your god, your hell....You Burn In It.

You call yourself an atheist, but would you really reject THE embodiment of morality, justice, fair treatment, and so on - when you saw it (i.e. is it a lack of evidence, or is it a matter of hatred)?

Umm, atheism has fuck all to do with any of that. Don't you even know what atheism is?
Lack of belief in god, that is it! That's all it is. It's got nothing to do with morality, justice, fairness, ect ect. It's one thing and one thing only. Lack of belief in god's existance.
Further more atheists ARE just as moralistic as theists, often more so. So no, we really don't reject "morality, justice, fair treatment, ect, ect".
You don't need belief in god to have these things.

people who reject the holy God is such that they deserve to burn in hell forever and ever.

I want to revisit this one.

So let me get this right. If one commits a finite victemless crime, then he/she is delt with an eternity of torture? Please point out the reasoning for this! Please point out where justice is actually done in this! Please point out the intelligence of this! Please point out the logic of this!

For someone to be infinitly tortured for a finite victemless crime is NOT rational!
I think this is nothing more than hate for those who do not believe in what you do.

[Purple Rabbit]

So IMO the worship that is given to God and the reason for that worship is evidence that God is a superior being.

And those who don't worship your particular subscribed religious beliefs are evidence of what exactly?

Others who choose not to believe as I do are only evidence of nonbelief no more no less. I do not worship a belief I worship the One I believe in period.

Get out of here, this is no decent argument. Your claim that your belief is proof of your god, is childishly circular. But even if it was a decent argument, from the same "logic" should follow that any god that was ever worshipped or is worshipped in the future, exists. I can't express in words the arrogant contempt of reason that is felt from such illogic.

[Edwardo Piet]

Evolution and upbringing. Since nothing was before God supposedly because he is supposedly the creator of everything - there can be no explanation FOR HIM. Which is why him with his random supernatural attributes is retarded.

EvF

[tackattack]

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1- The conditions aren't imposed on the part of the creator, they're due to the reciprocal dynamic of exchanging love. If my time here proves anything it's that love can be accepted or rejected, and reciprocated love still feels like love from the giving side, but not from the receiving side. I still say the unconditional part stands.

If you're going to undertake the pointless task of redefining the already defined concept of emotional love at least make it meaningful. And I still say the 'unconditional' part is fucking absurd and leaves us open to every conceivable form of abuse imaginable.

2- I agree on your point of your perception of the Biblical character of God, that's not love, that's manipulation, personification and misconception.

This is so bloody tedious. Let's make this interesting, I'm issuing you a challenge tack: quote one line just ONE event in the Bible where you disagree completely with your God concept's reckless actions, I dare you to cite one time where you found his character to be utterly immoral, repugnant and reprehensible. If you can successfully pull that (feat) off then just for you I'll quote a single passage from Biblical text where I find your tyrant godfather concept's decision(s)/action(s) to be benign and morally positive.

3- Anything worth having is worth sacrificing for. God does forgive everyone, what about that aren't you getting. He sacrificed for sinners and saints alike. His sacrifice wasn't just his death on the cross that was just the end of it. If you can't see the nobility of self-sacrifice through literally dying to give everyone a chance at eternal happiness, I don't think I can make you see anything different. IMO it seems like you're intentionally wearing blinders though.

I don't want eternal existence with your imaginery deity. Does your depraved god concept respect my heart-felt decision? Fuck no, according to you its fire and brimstone for me, hooray!

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1-It is meaningful. I'm missing your point. Maybe I'm misunderstanding your perspective but what kind of skewed perspective sees receiving unconditional love bringing up ideas of fucking absurdity and every conceivable form of abuse imaginable. Please help me see your perspective better.
2-Just one .. that's easy there are lots.
Hosea 13:16

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The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
because they have rebelled against their God.
They will fall by the sword;
their little ones will be dashed to the ground,
their pregnant women ripped open.

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Zephaniah 1:2-6

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"I will sweep away everything
from the face of the earth,"
declares the LORD.

3 "I will sweep away both men and animals;
I will sweep away the birds of the air
and the fish of the sea.
The wicked will have only heaps of rubble [a]
when I cut off man from the face of the earth,"
declares the LORD.
Against Judah
4 "I will stretch out my hand against Judah
and against all who live in Jerusalem.
I will cut off from this place every remnant of Baal,
the names of the pagan and the idolatrous priests-

5 those who bow down on the roofs
to worship the starry host,
those who bow down and swear by the LORD
and who also swear by Molech, [b]

6 those who turn back from following the LORD
and neither seek the LORD nor inquire of him.

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Numbers 31:7-18

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7 They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man. 8 Among their victims were Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur and Reba—the five kings of Midian. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. 9 The Israelites captured the Midianite women and children and took all the Midianite herds, flocks and goods as plunder. 10 They burned all the towns where the Midianites had settled, as well as all their camps. 11 They took all the plunder and spoils, including the people and animals, 12 and brought the captives, spoils and plunder to Moses and Eleazar the priest and the Israelite assembly at their camp on the plains of Moab, by the Jordan across from Jericho. [a]

13 Moses, Eleazar the priest and all the leaders of the community went to meet them outside the camp. 14 Moses was angry with the officers of the army—the commanders of thousands and commanders of hundreds—who returned from the battle.

15 "Have you allowed all the women to live?" he asked them. 16 "They were the ones who followed Balaam's advice and were the means of turning the Israelites away from the LORD in what happened at Peor, so that a plague struck the LORD's people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

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for just a few..No need for a challenge .. I've fully admitted that there are lots of atrocities attributed to God in the Bible.

3-I've never once said that you're going to hell, just that you're wearing blinders. If I can respect your decision, why wouldn't my God? You're entitled to your opinions and on this point we've obviously reached an impasse.

The nature of people who reject the holy God is such that they deserve to burn in hell forever and ever. These are the sorts of people who would harm undeserving others without a second thought (if they had the opportunity (e.g. no punishments from authorities)).

You call yourself an atheist, but would you really reject THE embodiment of morality, justice, fair treatment, and so on - when you saw it (i.e. is it a lack of evidence, or is it a matter of hatred)?

And those kinds of judgmental, hateful, and intolerant baseless assumptions are exactly what drive some people away from religion as a whole. God may be our judge in the ever-after, but he's quite certain that we're not to judge, lest we be judged.

[Purple Rabbit]

The conditions aren't imposed on the part of the creator, they're due to the reciprocal dynamic of exchanging love. If my time here proves anything it's that love can be accepted or rejected, and reciprocated love still feels like love from the giving side, but not from the receiving side. I still say the unconditional part stands.

Still talking about love as something that can be exchanged between humans and gods? I thought you agreed that gods are unable to feel and express human emotions, since gods are not human and humans are not gods. From that it follows that we should not label alleged divine behaviour with a category of human experience. Which makes me wonder, do you think gods can have any emotions as in unreasoned predispositions?

[Welsh cake]

1-It is meaningful. I'm missing your point. Maybe I'm misunderstanding your perspective but what kind of skewed perspective sees receiving unconditional love bringing up ideas of fucking absurdity and every conceivable form of abuse imaginable. Please help me see your perspective better.

What I'm saying is why redefine "love" to demonstrate a deity is supposedly "superior" to Homo sapiens? After all we already have the word and its associated meaning so this exercise seems rather pointless.

2-Just one .. that's easy there are lots.
Hosea 13:16

---

The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
because they have rebelled against their God.
They will fall by the sword;
their little ones will be dashed to the ground,
their pregnant women ripped open.

---

for just a few..No need for a challenge .. I've fully admitted that there are lots of atrocities attributed to God in the Bible.

Evil that's only attributed to God? *sigh* Well, I only asked for one but conversely I wish I could say it was as straightforward a task for me to find 'divine benevolence' as many Christian apologists claim, but just about every example in Old Testament Bibical text where God isn't slaughtering everyone is just a display of his character being utterly narcissistic and ultimately self-serving, there were few to choose from:

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"I, even I, am he who blots out your transgressions, for my own sake, and remembers your sins no more" (Isaiah 43:25).

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Again, see the highlighted text "from my own sake", not, for your sake, every action is to propagate his own glory, everything has to revolve around this petty little ego-manic. The New Testament doesn't help matters as its always a second party professing his morality, not God himself:

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Luke 6:27-37 (NRS) "But I say to you that listen, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you... Do to others as you would have them do to you. If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners love those who love them. If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same... But love your enemies, do good... and your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High; for he is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful... Forgive, and you will be forgiven."

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3-I've never once said that you're going to hell, just that you're wearing blinders.

By your faith where do you think I'm going after I'm worm-food?

If I can respect your decision, why wouldn't my God?

Because you care you've shown that you're more moral than your god concept and I wish you'd own up to that. If you had the kind of absolute power that's attributed to this deity, I'm confident, though not certain, that you'd use it to do good, regardless of whether people loved you back or not.

I know this is nothing grander than an appeal to emotion, but as far as the fictional concept of your god goes, he's demonstrated often that he doesn't give two shits about people like me, my existence, my hopes, my dreams, my family or my friends.

[Godscreated]

Min what ever makes you think I'm not golden. Hah hah just joking.

Welsh cake I read your article about circular arguments and it applies to atheist as well as christians when neither knows what they are talking about. Remember I've stated several times that I'm not a part of this forum to try and get others to believe in God I'm here to learn about God through your disbelief.

Purple Rabbit sorry if what I said upset you, the statement I made was about myself and myself alone. I'm not trying to convience you or anyone on this forum that they should believe in God. God has given the gift of freewill for you to decide what ever you wish and it's not for me to beat you or anyone else over the head with my beliefs.

[Purple Rabbit]

Purple Rabbit sorry if what I said upset you, the statement I made was about myself and myself alone. I'm not trying to convience you or anyone on this forum that they should believe in God. God has given the gift of freewill for you to decide what ever you wish and it's not for me to beat you or anyone else over the head with my beliefs.

Bafflement captures the expressed emotion more closely, I'd say. That it was a statement about yourself ("the worship that is given to God and the reason for that worship is evidence that God is a superior being") doesn't change the fact that it exposes that you think circular reasoning is sound reasoning.

Your perception that I might interpret this as a pressure of any kind to convince me, just is so cudly sweet, it brings tears to my eyes. It almost makes me wanna kneel down and pray something like "Sweet daddyo in the sky of this three storey universe, forgive this sorry ass, for he doesn't have a clue"

If there really was freewill in a acausal sense, you could choose your own will. Fact of life is that you can't. Just try it. Apart from that, i'm very interested in the part in the bible were god hands over the freewill to mankind. It poses some deep questions. If he handed freewill down to us, and at the same time freewill is our freewill, the will that we are willing, that sort of defines our personal specifics, than what was there to receive it and what configured it? Surely with nobody else around at the time, god must have configured that freewill to his likings, therewith rendering useless that very concept as a means to install independent agency in humans. It seems to me that this crap story is a rather cheap way of taking no responsibility for creation.

In conclusion, you can add more nonsense to a nonsensical argument, but it will never make more sense.