Posts: 4484
Threads: 185
Joined: October 12, 2012
Reputation:
44
Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 9:58 am
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2015 at 10:05 am by Aractus.)
So turns out Jared is a paedophile, and has had sex with under-age people and possessed child pornography. 
But there are two things that are interesting to me here. The first is the stigmatisation of "paedophiles"; and the second is the report that Subway was told about his behaviour by a franchisee in 2008 and did nothing.
The stigmatisation is clear because a psychiatrist testified in court that Jared has "mild paedophilia", and the judge said words to the effect of "that's not a proper diagnosis"... um, yes it is. Any mental disorder can be characterised as being mild, moderate, or severe or anything in-between. And furthermore, it's a part of human sexuality - and sexuality can't be accurately defined within boundaries. Some people are only sexually attracted to children, but others are sexually attracted to adults as well and perhaps this is what the psychiatrist meant. Still others that abuse children may not be true paedophiles (that is sexually attracted to them) and may be purely an act of violence like rape.
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50. -LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea. -LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
Posts: 6946
Threads: 26
Joined: April 28, 2012
Reputation:
83
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 10:06 am
Is mild paedophilia like being mildly pregnant? Does it mean you want to fuck kids, but gently? One is either sexually attracted to kids or not.
Posts: 4484
Threads: 185
Joined: October 12, 2012
Reputation:
44
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 10:11 am
Great more mental health stigmatisation.
A person doesn't get to choose, Cato, whether they're sexually attracted to children. All they get to chose is how to respond. I believe that most paedophiles choose not to act on their sexual urges in an inappropriate way. However I imagine that even if they don't act on their urges a number of them would turn to child pornography. And childporn itself could act as a "gateway" for at-risk people to then actually offend.
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50. -LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea. -LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
Posts: 202
Threads: 4
Joined: November 2, 2015
Reputation:
5
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 10:31 am
(November 21, 2015 at 10:11 am)Aractus Wrote: And childporn itself could act as a "gateway" for at-risk people to then actually offend.
That or it could prove to be a safe way for people who are shunned by society to have an outlet for their fantasies without actually hurting anyone. 
Posts: 15351
Threads: 118
Joined: January 13, 2014
Reputation:
117
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 10:46 am
(November 21, 2015 at 10:31 am)Ludwig Wrote: (November 21, 2015 at 10:11 am)Aractus Wrote: And childporn itself could act as a "gateway" for at-risk people to then actually offend.
That or it could prove to be a safe way for people who are shunned by society to have an outlet for their fantasies without actually hurting anyone.
....except for the children being raped and exploited to create the videos.
But, you know, nobody else is getting hurt.
"There remain four irreducible objections to religious faith: that it wholly misrepresents the origins of man and the cosmos, that because of this original error it manages to combine the maximum servility with the maximum of solipsism, that it is both the result and the cause of dangerous sexual repression, and that it is ultimately grounded on wish-thinking." ~Christopher Hitchens, god is not Great
PM me your email address to join the Slack chat! I'll give you a taco(or five) if you join! --->There's an app and everything!<---
Posts: 14932
Threads: 684
Joined: August 25, 2008
Reputation:
143
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 11:02 am
Completely agree Aractus. Pedophilia is a diagnosable disorder; people seem to forget that.
People also seen to forget that pedophilia isn't illegal, nor should it be. Having feelings of sexual attraction (which you can't control) shouldn't be punished in any fair justice system. Acting on those feelings, when the party you are acting on cannot consent (as in the case of sexual intercourse with a minor) is illegal.
There are likely pedophiles (perhaps most pedophiles) who do not act on their sexual attractions, just as most people do not rape people they are sexually attracted to. Unfortunately the only pedophiles you tend to hear about are the ones that are caught breaking the law.
Posts: 30129
Threads: 304
Joined: April 18, 2014
Reputation:
92
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 11:04 am
Probably needs a topic of it's own, but the Jimmy Savile case has been astonishing on several levels. That Subway did nothing as early as 2008 correlates with the apparently massive numbers of reports on Savile that resulted in no action.
I'm still thinking the Savile case is 'unique' in the reported diversity of his offenses.
The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it.
Posts: 4659
Threads: 123
Joined: June 27, 2014
Reputation:
40
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 11:08 am
(November 21, 2015 at 10:46 am)SteelCurtain Wrote: (November 21, 2015 at 10:31 am)Ludwig Wrote: That or it could prove to be a safe way for people who are shunned by society to have an outlet for their fantasies without actually hurting anyone.
....except for the children being raped and exploited to create the videos.
But, you know, nobody else is getting hurt.
Aside from this, when you are watching CP you are economically creating a demand in the market for such content - There is a market for illegal products, whether it is drugs, guns, child porn or any other kind of illegal stuff - When you watch CP, even if you're not participating in the act yourself and are not profiting, distributing or selling it, you are still creating a demand by adding one more viewer to the videos.
I do agree with Aractus that paedophilia is a disorder like any other and should be treated whenever possible. It should be illegal to have sex with children, not to feel attraction to them.
I would also like to note that when we're talking about pedos we're looking at a a very large group that may not fit anyone's stereotypes. For example, there's pedos who only like children, and there's pedos who also like adults and even marry/have sex. There's pedos who are the stereotypical 30-50 year old man, but it's possible for a pedo to be a woman or to be much younger.
Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you
Posts: 4659
Threads: 123
Joined: June 27, 2014
Reputation:
40
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 11:10 am
(November 21, 2015 at 11:02 am)Tiberius Wrote: Completely agree Aractus. Pedophilia is a diagnosable disorder; people seem to forget that.
People also seen to forget that pedophilia isn't illegal, nor should it be. Having feelings of sexual attraction (which you can't control) shouldn't be punished in any fair justice system. Acting on those feelings, when the party you are acting on cannot consent (as in the case of sexual intercourse with a minor) is illegal.
There are likely pedophiles (perhaps most pedophiles) who do not act on their sexual attractions, just as most people do not rape people they are sexually attracted to. Unfortunately the only pedophiles you tend to hear about are the ones that are caught breaking the law.
One more thing - Not everyone who has sex with kids is a clinical paedophilie. Basically, there's people who take advantage of anyone they can and will have sex with incapable, animals, kids, everyone basically - You're a paedophile if you feel attracted to kids, but if you have sex with kids just because you want to satisfy your libido with any human being available (or animal) that is not clinical paedophilia. Just think of countries where the majority of marriages are child marriages - Does anyone believe that something like 60% of the male population is clinically a paedophilie?
Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you
Posts: 29107
Threads: 218
Joined: August 9, 2014
Reputation:
155
RE: Jared Fogle & Subway
November 21, 2015 at 11:10 am
(This post was last modified: November 21, 2015 at 11:14 am by robvalue.)
Yeah, it's got to the stage where you have to put a qualifier like "non-active" or something in front of paedophile, or else people will assume the person is already abusing children. Since that word has been hijacked almost entirely, I don't think we have a replacement, non-stigmatized word.
The condition itself needs to be met with understanding, not hostility. I have the deepest sympathy for anyone who is forced to live with these urges and has no legal way to act on them. Of course, if they harm a kid, or download child porn, I lose all sympathy.
|
