The death of Catholicism.

[dyresand]

Now that Europe has turned increasingly secular and American catholics don't pay much attention to it if it is the least bit inconvenient they are making an effort to spread to Africa/Asia.  Religion always thrives where ignorance is strong but there are lot of competitors for a decreasing share of a market.

I suspect that the church will be unrecognizable in 50-100 years.

There is a lot of christian persecution in Asia no abrahamic god is NOT wanted there.
They pretty much know how the abrahamic religions are and want nothing to do with it.

^i had to fix that.

[Jehanne]

It seems that Catholicism is becoming more and more secular by the day.  With Francis' proposed decentralization of the Church and its declining numbers throughout first-world nations, how long does the Catholic Faith have left until it is abandoned completely?

The thing you've got to remember about the Junta pope is that he's more pr savvy than what preceded him, but theologically little difference exists, between him and, say, pope Nazi. You have to look not at what he is saying to the secular western media, but what he says to people he securely believes are true followers. What he is telling them are the same messages peddled by the rcc since the 1860's. Look at what he said when in the Philippines a few years ago, his message was misogynistic and homophobic baiting, or even his hour long chat with your one who wouldn't do her job and issue marriage certs to gay couples.

He's clever enough to know that if he lays on enough smaltz and doublespeak the western media will be too lazy to investigate his true message.

He certainly does speak out of "both ends" at times.  But, consider the "gay" question.  Considering that the Catholic Church condemned the "sin of Sodom" for over 2 millennia, how can the Church now embrace "gay love" without folks coming along and saying that the Church is contradicting itself?  And, if the Church contradicts itself (which, of course, it does and has), is not such evidence that it is just another man-made institution and not one founded upon any sort of divine "revelation"; and if so, why bother with it?  Speaking from a "person in the pew" perspective here.  As an atheist, I am definitively not trying to "defend" it; only surmising why Catholics may abandon it entirely and their reasons for doing so.

[abaris]

He certainly does speak out of "both ends" at times.  But, consider the "gay" question.  Considering that the Catholic Church condemned the "sin of Sodom" for over 2 millennia, how can the Church now embrace "gay love" without folks coming along and saying that the Church is contradicting itself?  And, if the Church contradicts itself (which, of course, it does and has), is not such evidence that it is just another man-made institution and not one founded upon any sort of divine "revelation"; and if so, why bother with it?  Speaking from a "person in the pew" perspective here.  As an atheist, I am definitively not trying to "defend" it; only surmising why Catholics may abandon it entirely and their reasons for doing so.

Don't overestimate the intellect of staunch believers. And don't underestimate the will for change among moderate catholics. There are quite a lot of grassroot groups calling for a different stance on homosexuality. Comprised of laymen as well as priests.

[Brian37]

ALL religions will die and go extinct when our species goes extinct. But outside that, as with all religions, we can expect any given religion to be either revised and split, and change, or die out completely.

[TrueChristian]

It won't die off since even many former Catholics hold some nostalgia/fondness for the Church.

It will however be quite unrecongizable in 50 years or so.

Because of the revelations of pedophilia and general sexual dysfunction the Church has had to pay nearly 2 billion in settlements. I find it hard to believe more will not be revealed sooner or later.

It will be forced to change because there will not be enough priests and the outside world will continue to not agree with it's unreasoanble teachings on sexuality.

If you study it's history you will notice the Church often changes dramatically (though the true faithful will deny it.)

One hundred years ago it would have been inconceivable for a priest or bishop to portray Judaism as a worthy religion and Jews themselves as worthwhile human beings. Until the end of WW2 it was encourgaed to pray for the conversion of the Jews specifically, more so than the average heathen.

There is (was) a long tradtion in Catholicism of disliking the Jewish people. Not only for "killing Jesus" but also for stubbornly refusing to acknowledge God's messiah to them, thus being in a "dead covenant" with the Lord.

I suppose the holocaust, the culimination of 2000 years worth of Christian dehumanization of Jews, embarassed the Church into acknowleding the humanity of the Jewish people.

My prediction? In 30 years or so the Church will be a slightly more conservative version of Episcopalianism.

[abaris]

I suppose the holocaust, the culimination of 2000 years worth of Christian dehumanization of Jews, embarassed the Church into acknowleding the humanity of the Jewish people.

The Holocaust had much more to do with the idea of Eugenics and German nationalism, surfacing in the late 19th century than it had with the old clerical antisemitism. It had absolutely nothing to do with religion. In fact, the people calling the shots, went to great lengths to make it look a biological necessity. Bullshit, of course, but not rleigious bullshit.

[Whateverist]

Couldn't decide which one to choose. I'm pretty sure catholicness will be around as long as we are .. I just can't decide how long that will be.

[TrueChristian]

I suppose the holocaust, the culimination of 2000 years worth of Christian dehumanization of Jews, embarassed the Church into acknowleding the humanity of the Jewish people.

The Holocaust had much more to do with the idea of Eugenics and German nationalism, surfacing in the late 19th century than it had with the old clerical antisemitism. It had absolutely nothing to do with religion. In fact, the people calling the shots, went to great lengths to make it look a biological necessity. Bullshit, of course, but not rleigious bullshit.

True enough. Nazism was not a religious phenomena, even if it had religious people in it.

My point is that even if the RCC wasn't responsible for the holocaust, and even if Priests and nuns tried to hide Jewish refugees, the Church (and Christianity generally) helped pave the way for it by dehumanizing Jews for so long.

Even if the Nazi/eugenics ideology wasn't clerical, the clerical antisemitism helped Germans and others "Get on board" with it IMO.

[Cephus]

Abandoned completely?  Probably a very long time, there are still people out there practicing Norse religions.  Before it loses all of it's political and social power?  No more than a century.  I'm hoping that all religion will essentially be viewed as a quaint notion within that time.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

The thing you've got to remember about the Junta pope is that he's more pr savvy than what preceded him, but theologically little difference exists, between him and, say, pope Nazi. You have to look not at what he is saying to the secular western media, but what he says to people he securely believes are true followers. What he is telling them are the same messages peddled by the rcc since the 1860's. Look at what he said when in the Philippines a few years ago, his message was misogynistic and homophobic baiting, or even his hour long chat with your one who wouldn't do her job and issue marriage certs to gay couples.

He's clever enough to know that if he lays on enough smaltz and doublespeak the western media will be too lazy to investigate his true message.

He certainly does speak out of "both ends" at times.  But, consider the "gay" question.  Considering that the Catholic Church condemned the "sin of Sodom" for over 2 millennia, how can the Church now embrace "gay love" without folks coming along and saying that the Church is contradicting itself?  And, if the Church contradicts itself (which, of course, it does and has), is not such evidence that it is just another man-made institution and not one founded upon any sort of divine "revelation"; and if so, why bother with it?  Speaking from a "person in the pew" perspective here.  As an atheist, I am definitively not trying to "defend" it; only surmising why Catholics may abandon it entirely and their reasons for doing so.

They started losing members when they stopped burning witches alive.