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Atheist Forums › Community › Philosophy v
When are we not ourselves?

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When are we not ourselves?
KUSA Offline
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#71
When are we not ourselves?
June 17, 2016 at 2:22 pm
(June 17, 2016 at 1:36 pm)ohreally Wrote: By your method the baby being born isn't even the same person as when the first cell division happened so how can you ever be the same as you were before.

You aren't.

Look at a river. Close your eyes for a few seconds and open them back up. Are you looking at the same river? The water has all been replaced. What you first looked at is now gone.

We are the same as the river. We have the same name but the water has changed.
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The Grand Nudger Offline
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#72
RE: When are we not ourselves?
June 17, 2016 at 2:24 pm (This post was last modified: June 17, 2016 at 2:29 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Opening and closing my eyes doesn't have an effect on the Mississippi.  It's still the Mississippi.  If I was looking at the same molecules of water it wouldn't even be a river...because rivers flow, I'd be looking at a lake, lol....a preturnaturally still one.

(general ship of theseus stuff usually comes down to conventions of classification and arguments by subtle equivocation)
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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Angrboda Offline
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#73
RE: When are we not ourselves?
June 17, 2016 at 2:33 pm
(June 17, 2016 at 2:22 pm)KUSA Wrote:
(June 17, 2016 at 1:36 pm)ohreally Wrote: By your method the baby being born isn't even the same person as when the first cell division happened so how can you ever be the same as you were before.

You aren't.

Look at a river. Close your eyes for a few seconds and open them back up. Are you looking at the same river? The water has all been replaced. What you first looked at is now gone.

We are the same as the river. We have the same name but the water has changed.

You seem to be arguing that 'I' am nothing more than my cells. I find this a false notion. 'I' am a model of things associated with my brain and body maintained by the mind. As a process, changes of state are to be expected, but I am not any one particular state. Just as a 'river' is an abstraction for a body of flowing water, the 'I' is an abstraction describing a person. The individual molecules making up that person are not the abstraction.
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ohreally Offline
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#74
RE: When are we not ourselves?
June 17, 2016 at 4:26 pm
(June 17, 2016 at 2:22 pm)KUSA Wrote:
(June 17, 2016 at 1:36 pm)ohreally Wrote: By your method the baby being born isn't even the same person as when the first cell division happened so how can you ever be the same as you were before.

You aren't.

Look at a river. Close your eyes for a few seconds and open them back up. Are you looking at the same river? The water has all been replaced. What you first looked at is now gone.

We are the same as the river. We have the same name but the water has changed.

No need to even close your eyes.  What you are describing is the definition of a river acting as it should.

My reply was to your OP which is about changing from a previous version of you.  I'm asking which previous version are you measuring.
If water rots the soles of your boots, what does it do to your intestines?
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KUSA Offline
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#75
When are we not ourselves?
June 17, 2016 at 6:03 pm
(June 17, 2016 at 4:26 pm)ohreally Wrote: My reply was to your OP which is about changing from a previous version of you.  I'm asking which previous version are you measuring.

Every previous version. I am a version of a version of a version etc.
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Atheist Forums › Community › Philosophy v
When are we not ourselves?

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